LMGs - the most unpolished weapon class (imo)

Suggestions
1

Some of roles of LMGs in games:

  • overwhelming fire on short-mid range and mid-long range while bipoded
  • area control weapon
  • crowd control weapon
  • choke point defence

LMGs in the Enlisted are far from doing most of that.
Currently probably the best usage of LMGs is to use them like SMGs. It’s caused by many factors:

  • almost no penalty for wielding big, heavy weapon
    https://youtu.be/f8S2rBk88kM
    As you can see, this weapon is long but it still can be used, even if soldier is headbutting the wall (I can’t aim but it doesn’t matter at that distance), it shouldn’t work like that. Soldier should press weapon to his breast if there is no room for it (although it may cause even bigger SMG meta).
    The other problem is that I can turn an LMG that weighs ~12 kg as fast as pistol that weighs ~1kg and is ~6 times shorter. It should be far easier to turn with light and short weapons than long and heavy ones. I think about sth like delay, example: when you rotate left with heavy weapon, it is not on the center of the screen like now, but on the right of the screen and when you stop turning it goes to the center of the screen.

  • buggy bipods
    https://youtu.be/AVCiKijJNRE
    It’s too much effort to find spot where you can mount your weapon AND have reasonable line of sight (so you see sth more than the wall of the opposite building).
    Even if you find one, turning range of the mounted weapons is pathetic. This is an extreme example:
    https://youtu.be/dSSgRWw46lk
    This is the most frustrating mounting mechanic I have ever used in a video game. It has to be fixed if we want LMGs to do what they are supposed to do.
    Also I would like to suggest this mechanic from H&G:
    https://youtu.be/ss5mYMQa1sY
    You can see that red icon appears and crosshair suddenly gets bigger when I rise the gun too high. This gun is bipoded but when I move it in a position where it can’t be bipoded, it loses all benefits from being bipoded while still being bipoded.
    English is not my native language so I have no idea how to explain it better, you have to understand yourself what’s happening on that video.
    Anyway, it’s really nice quality of life feature.

  • heavier LMGs can be used like assault rifles
    What I mean is that even big and heavy LMGs are still quite easy to control while standing straight and firing. I propose two solutions:
    a) heavy weapons have much more sway if not bipoded (hand of the shooter is geting tired). Don’t confuse this one with gun recoil / muzzle climb.
    b) split LMGs into two categories:

    1. Guns like BAR, chauchat etc. work like now.
    2. Guns like MG34, M1919A4 etc. (so heavy ones) are unable to ADS if not bipoded. They still can use walking fire but only from the hip, probably with usage of this:
      https://youtu.be/oOVEXBeA-eI
      That kind of “hip fire” is present in BFV, PS, HLL.

    Either of those options require fix of the mounting system.

  • no crowd control
    In other words: we have no suppression effect. There is no penalty for being under fire both for player and for bots. It results in killing let’s say 7 soldiers while other stand in the open and try to kill you instead of trying to find cover.
    I guess that if you can be calm while burning alive and shoot the guy with flamethrower, couple of bullets flying around are no big deal.
    It’s mechanic used by sim games (Arrma, PS, HLL) and arcade ones (BF, Division). (In comparason to the Enlisted.)

  • reloading
    It’s connected with the previous point.
    When you are shooting, the enemy stares at you and if you have to reload you either: undeploy and hide to reload; turn so you are mostly in cover while reloading; die attempting to reload while x enemies are in front of you.
    It should be better with supresion so I won’t suggest anything else for now.

  • lack of big magazines
    (I don’t count MG nests with unlimited ammo here.)
    ~50 rounds in a mag is big for this game but it’s basically pathetic when compared to other games (mainly BF) which have even 200 round magazines.
    It’s debatable if it should be role of LMGs or MG nests, I think that both should be able to hold the ground reliably.
    It’s also connected with chocke point deffence. I had many situations where I was pre aimed at one entrance but enemy came in a horde so I got overrun instantly when I had to reload after killing few of them.
    Although it’s probably bad idea because of the ballance.

  • run and gun gameplay
    The game is very much focused about being in move. I would say that being stationary with mounted gun is a downside in comparison to running and hip firing left, right, centre.
    No idea what to do here, but it may be connected with the next point.

  • maps
    Most of the maps don’t give much opion for a good place to mount a weapon. You are either easy to snipe down because of long distance, or you don’t have turning range to kill enemies that are next to you.
    I would also say that maps are to small for this kind of weapon. When I respawn I’m 150m away from the point. In other games it’s my engagement distance.

  • overheating
    It’s needed as a balance mechanic. Simple as that.

Those are only my thoughts so you may not agree with any of them. You may treat this post as kind of a wish list, than something that should be in game.

Ps.
I have to say that I have never had so much problems with using LMGs in any other game. So I don’t think it’s L2P issue. But who knows, maybe I’m out of shape.

11 Likes
2

Game is so fast paced. So true this action speed making LMGs like heavy SMGs with penalty, especially in Lone Fighter mode.

In Squad mode no tactical fights so LMG doing it’s job I think. But in current situation it doesn’t fit properly in Lone Fighter mode.

1 Like
3

I wouldn’t say there is any major penalty tbh.

4

My only issue with LMGs is mainly Breda Mod.30 it was never issued any german unit outside italy and even then in really insinificant numbers!

5

If that’s your only issue then you don’t have much experience with LMGs in games I guess :grin:
I’m joking of course.
In my opinion it’s more important to have working LMGs than to have historically accurate poop.

6

inevitable without morale. And morale just doesn’t fit into this game imo.

7

Well, LMGs should have supressing fire effect!

1 Like
8

Simply force cover for bots and suppression effect for players. This should be enough.

9

Soo automatic weapon users won’t even have to hit anymore to just kek on bolt action users and make them useless through suppression? Yeah that won’t work chief.

10

It works in BF, Arma, PS, HLL so why not here?

Ps.
It reminded me of simmilar discusion I had in H&G forum on the same topic.
“It won’t fit the game because it’s too realistic”
“Arcade games like BF have it too”
“… no!”

I’m not comparing that situation to our discusion. Just to be clear.

11

Players will see it as a punishment mechanic instead of a realism mechanic. This isn’t a milsim game.
To lose the ability to fight because someone fired in your general direction is not fun.

12

Is BF mili sim?

13

Nah, bf is just a big heckin mess. I just see no reason to add suppression. If you can see the enemy, the MG should be able to kill said enemy. Not make it incapable of combat.

14

That’s the case of MG position. Flank it, simple as that. Or use sniper/tank/mortar/arty strike.
I’m not going to give up on this mechanic because 90% of the players don’t use brain.

15

I mean I wouldn’t mind if the MG was just so lethal that the player actually started using their brains and take cover, like in D-Day. But that is suppression due to player morale, instead of some ingame system.

Give AI the ability to mount/deploy MGs

16

Ok, that’s something I can agree with. (It should also have supression effect on bots so player on the receiving end does not lose them stupidly)
But it creates next problem: “booo! nerf MGs! MG OP plz remove!”
So in my opinion suppresion is lesser evil.
To be clear, I think of a suppression that kicks in after some time so you have chance to react. Not one bullet = ptsd

17

MG nests are powerful but can be countered with snipers etc.
So the heavier MGs should be made more powerful in their deployed state, aka increase their belt size to 100 from 50, increase accuracy, etc, but remove the ability to ADS and heavily increase recoil and movement speed penalty when not deployed. There is no need to tack suppression on top of this rework imo.

18

100000% agree with this one.

Actually I found one major problem: even less fear of death then in other games.
You have basically 9 attempts to snipe down MG. I’m not sure if anyone will care if they lose 8 soldiers to one MG as long as it doesn’t count as death.

19

Due to the nature of AI, they tend to go down because they get out of cover when you go down.

20

I assumed that player has a brain and orders his AI to hide inside of the building and serve as lives while he deals with MG. So he still has 8 bots after his potential death.

Anyway player is not scared enough to give a F about MG shooting at him. Unless you have really good spot that nobody can counter from front.
Or at least that’s my experience in other games. Maybe yours is different.

Story time

I played BF4 hardcore with my friend. Because it was hardcore server it took 1-2 bullets to kill. We both took MGs with the biggest mag and set up to have a view at one of the doors from the enemy spawn.
The plan was simple: one of us holds LMB as long as possible while the other one reloads. Then we switch roles. We also had ammo boxes and active protection system to hopefully avoid RPGs.
Enemies tried to rush us with different intensity through the whole match. There were short moments when nobody attacked (or we didn’t notice) but generally we were constantly in a fight.
At the end of the match, the enemy made a final push. We were close to be broken (I was down and my friend had less and less bullets with every second) but it wasn’t enough, we survived.