Rounding Out BR 5 For All Nations

I think most players agree that each nation should provide something different at each tier, and not necessarily be a carbon-copy of each other. While this is true, I think we can also agree that weapons such as the Type Hei Automatic and T20 Rifles have created some major discrepancies in the capabilities of each nation. I might consider making a YouTube video covering this subject in more detail, but I’ll present my suggestions with basic information for now.

Please note that my findings are a combination of posts from people within this forum, as well as some primary and secondary sources found by myself. Without further ado:

USSR

The AVT-40 has the lowest magazine capacity of the BR 5 self-loading rifles. It’s been suggested before, but 25 round magazines were developed. Perhaps this could be a foldered unlock below the current AVT-40?

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Also, it may be controversial, but T-44-100 may be worth consideration as an additional BR 5 tank option. The 100mm gun would offer more flexibility than the 122mm on the IS-2s, and the mobility would be slightly better. The catch is that the armor, while having pretty good UFP protection against the Tiger II, would still be relatively easy to penetrate. If this is considered too OP, then the Object 245 or 248 (IS-2 prototypes mounting 100m guns) could also be considered.

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USA

USA currently does not have a BR 5 assault rifle. The M2 Carbine could possibly be moved to this position. Regardless of the M2 Carbine being moved or not, I believe the Hyde M1944 Carbine would fit here beautifully. Firing .30 Carbine at 600-1200 RPM (I would put it at 800 or 900 RPM in-game), it could be given slightly better damage over distance than the Thompson .30, allowing it to compete at short-mid ranges but not quite have the range capabilities of the StG or AS-44.

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USA also does not have a competitive Anti-Tank weapon at BR 5. I would introduce the T24 3.25-Inch Rocket Launcher as a BR 4 rocket launcher, which had approx. 200mm penetrative performance. In other words, it would be very comparable to the German Offenrohr.

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GERMANY

Whether or not the reader considers the FG.42 II and StG.44 to be worse than the AVT 40 or Federov respectively, I think it would be interesting for Germany to have more options. I would introduce the G.43 Selbstlader as a new BR 5 self-loading rifle (I’ve seen it also been referred to as the G.43 Dauerfeuerrichtung). According to tests in late 1942 it had the same fire rate as the FG.42 at 13-14 rounds per second (780-840 RPM), with a 25 round magazine capacity.

Now here’s where a bit of subjectivity on my end comes into play. The FG.42 and FG.42 II historically had different fire rates in real life: the FG.42 fired up to 900 RPM according to some sources, while the FG.42 II only fired at a rate of 600 RPM. Whether or not changes to these weapons in the game are really feasible or not, the G.43 Selbstlader could provide the opportunity for Germany to both have a self-loading rifle at 600 RPM and 750 RPM. This is important as the ~600 RPM self-loading rifles are capable of 1-tapping players with Vitality.

Historically Accurate Rates of Fire:
FG.42 II (600 RPM) → G.43 Selbstlader (780 RPM) → FG.42 (780 RPM)

Historically Flexible Rates of Fire (less work for Darkflow):
G.43 Selbstlader (600 RPM) → FG.42 (750 RPM) → FG.42 II (750 RPM)

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As for Assault Rifles, Germany could also receive the Vollmer MKb.35. The current weapon in-game (MKb.35/III) is this weapon, with a couple of changes in addition to a slowed fire rate. Originally, this weapon had a fire rate of 700 RPM. It could be seen as an option for players who want a faster rate of fire than the StG.44, but want to maintain damage over range compared to the 39M Kiraly. It also only has a magazine capacity of 20 rounds.

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Another option (while less is known about it), is the Mauser MKb. The pictured version is the MKb.35, chambered in 7x39.1mm DWM with likely a 20 round magazine. I have yet to find a rate of fire for the weapon, but it could possibly be a good German competitor to the Federov. There was also a Mauser MKb.42 chambered in 7.92mm (Kurz, or another intermediate cartridge length) in 30 round magazines, but specifics or even images are lacking.

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Finally, if we wanted to consider giving Germany their own RD-44, there’s the Czech ZK-423 machine gun, chambered in 7.92x33 Kurz:

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JAPAN

Japan does not yet have an assault rifle. My very unoriginal suggestion is to add the Type 2 SMG chambered in 6.5x30mm. It would have a very standard 600 RPM fire rate, and was intended to be able to penetrate thick winter coats at up to 700m range. In comparison to the aforementioned Hyde M1944 Carbine used by USA, it would have a slower rate of fire, but better damage retention over distance. If you want something at high tier with sheer damage output, the Tokyo Arsenal fits that niche.

More info on 6.5x30mm ammunition in Japanese SMGs can be found in this Warspot.ru article. Provided below are links to it in Russian, and Google Translated:
Упорство, достойное лучшего применения | Warspot.ru
https://warspot-ru.translate.goog/12128-uporstvo-dostoynoe-luchshego-primeneniya?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_hist=true

Japan is also currently lacking a proper AT weapon at high BRs. It’s been suggested multiple times already, but the Type 97 AT rifle firing Ji-Te Dan HEAT projectiles would be perfect. The projectiles are claimed to penetrate 200-250mm (I have no source for this), and I would add a shield to it for added character.

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I might make a YouTube video going further in-depth on some of these weapons and vehicle, and possibly to bring the ideas to a broader audience. Thanks for your consideration!

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Great suggestions, hopefully Darkflow adds this stuff.

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This and the Type 4 90mm rocket launcher are a must for Japan, the Ji-Te Dan grenade would have a very short range so a rocket launcher with good velocity is needed to fill the range gap.

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1587855128e4889b537217659132
I love Gewehr43, I want that gun!!!

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All round good suggestions in my opinion. Sounds like some fun stuff

I have to address this though. The T20 and Hei Auto didn’t create discrepancies, they fixed discrepancies. The Sovies and Axis both had full power auto rifles (FG is an LMG but we’ll ignore that) while the US and Japan lacked these weapons. Now, all nations have full power auto rifles. Almost all have intermediate cartridge automatics. Almost all have some stupid OP LMG. The Germans aren’t suffering here. They’re finally fighting an Allied faction on even footing and can’t handle it because without “superior German engineering” they can’t do jack

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You should be the developer for this game! Hands down.

Alongside the ZK-423 MG Germany can also get the MG-08/15 as their counterpart to the Maxim Tokarev. 100 round magazine with a 500 RoF. (I am not mentioning the 250-500 round magazine for balance reasons but it might be an event weapon as well)
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Something much less complicated for Axis:

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“Ja, I’m happy, because my mg42, the most iconic ww2 weapon of all time, has a long ammunition belt of 100 (or more) rounds!”

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Totally valid argument! The game would be far less balanced without them, but I think they make great standards for future additions, creating more player choice and balancing the game even more.

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Laughs in greatest battle implement ever devised

Yes no tchechian shit gun´s we need made in germany

The anti-tank weapons of the United States and Japan presented in this article are unreliable sources.

First, the T24 3.25-inch bazooka, which I researched previously, has no information on its penetration capability available anywhere. I would like to request a source for this. In reality, this model fell short compared to the M18 recoilless rifle, suggesting that its penetration capability was lower than the M18.

Regarding Japanese anti-tank weapons, I searched for sources claiming a penetration capability of 200mm to 250mm, but I only found forum posts and not reliable data. In contrast, Wikipedia and Russian sources suggest a penetration of only 50mm. Frankly, if it had a 200mm penetration capability, it would be comparable to the Ho-Ri Mk. II, which seems like a fantasy specification.

While there is a lack of reliable data on high-penetration Japanese anti-tank weapons, there are alternatives for the U.S. weapons.

You can check the following links:

From these links, you can see that the T59e3 rocket used in the U.S. M9A1 bazooka has a penetration capability of 210mm. This can be proposed as an alternative.

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Off topic but sweet dead space

Can you give me the link of it?

It is weird to compare penetration capability of an anti tank weapon with a vehicle. Other countries like Germany did have at weapon with such performance and if you consider the diameter of the projectile it might not be that fantasy.

50 mm seems very low given the estimated size of the projectile, which would be identical to the 40 mm projectile, and I find that hard to believe.Maybe I’m wrong but it’s suspicious.Type 2 rifle grenade launcher - Wikipedia

Please note that the information I have provided is maybe not 100% accurate, as it comes from Wikipedia.

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It seems the translation was off. I wasn’t comparing it to the specifications of tanks, but rather saying that it has exaggerated specs similar to those of the Hori tank. There are no materials that state it has 200mm of penetration capability; the only evidence is a post on the Enlisted forum.

always check quoted source if you can find it.

It seems I misunderstood the information about the 50mm penetration capability, and I apologize for that. However, I couldn’t find any sources that state the 97-type automatic cannon’s shells had 200mm of penetration capability. The original claim was based on a post on Enlisted Reddit that combined photos. According to the Japanese Wikipedia, research on this was planned to begin in March of Showa 18 (1943) but was discontinued the same year. At least, I have no basis for claiming that this weapon had 50mm of penetration capability, nor is there clear evidence that it had 200mm of penetration capability.

Here is the link to the Japanese Wikipedia page: タ弾 - Wikipedia

Sorry I’m using a translator, what I mean is that I used wikipedia to “ilustrate” my words and so I was warning that the information on this site is not 100% reliable (but if I think that everyone is aware I wanted to say so).

The 200mm penetration was estimated by the guy who posted it.

The original claim is from this.

But the projectile diameter it stated is 40 - 50 mm, which is way less than the picture.
Maybe they are different projectile developed for the same gun.