Please correct the Király39M and 43M stats

Suggestions
1

Hello bajtársak and fellow forum dwellers.

After having read A Király géppisztoly, the most comprehensive book on the Király SMG family. I have discovered some anomalies in the game stats.

IMG_20240419_132346
IMG_20240419_1323461872×4000 501 KB

The book even includes the official evaluation of the Hungarian army of Király39M from 1942.

IMG_20240419_131429
IMG_20240419_1314291872×4000 243 KB

The rate of fire of the Király39M is incorrect.
The documents clearly state that it can (theoretically) fire 650-700 rounds per minute.
Neither the stock rof (760) nor the max upgraded rof (820) match the real values.
Some sources do claim a rof of 720 rpm but that is still less than in game.

IMG_20240419_131436
IMG_20240419_1314361872×2561 211 KB

Wikipedia sites often inaccurately claim 700-800 rpm. As our friendly cat helper once said:

The 9x25 Mauser export the Király fires is much more powerful than the 9x19 parabellum, perhaps the Király could get a very minor damage buff to compensate for the lowered rpm.

The documentation claims that the effective range of the Király is an extremely impressive 600m. This is more than double the effective range the average WW2 SMGs had and it’s not just hype, all sources agree that the Király was praised for its accuracy by Hungarian soldiers.

range
range1872×2561 210 KB

Hungary during the second world war didn’t even consider adopting semi-auto rifles or assault rifles because they believed that the Király already fulfilled a similar role.

The in-game dispersion and damage drop over distance of both the 39M and 43M don’t reflect the real Király SMGs and are disappointing. Sadly Királys in the game are nothing more than counter to the ppsh41, sharing many stats with it.
Királys should be unique, have the least dispersion out of all SMGs and they should do a bit more damage over distance than they do at the moment.

Just on a minor note, Both Király39M and 43M have the same muzzle velocity of 445 m/s in game, but that is for the Király43M while the Király39M has 450 m/s muzzle velocity.
Nothing major or game breaking, but I would be very happy if it was corrected.

26 Likes
2

Fun fact:
It’s called Király not only because it was designed by Pál Király, but also because it is the Király (King) of submachine guns. A weapon more powerful, more accurate and most importantly more elegant than any other submachine gun was at its time of introduction in 1939.

10 Likes
3

Sounds good,and with that move it down a BR or 2 while at it!

4

I mean if we’re correcting stats, may I suggest the M1 and the M1? Lol

1 Like
5

9x25 might be more powerful - but 600 m effective range? This can’t be true. that’s basically the limits for 7.62x39…

6

This is kind of correct forgotten weapons mentions that 39M had fire rate of 750 rounds per minute Imma trust Ian on this one I don’t want 39M to be nerfed also forgotten weapons mentions that it had a muzzle velocity of 455 M/s

7

It has 50 percent more energy than of 9mm lugar but I, too believe it is not enough to make the effective range 600 meters though forgotten weapons mentions that sights on 39m could be set from 50m up to 600 so it might be possible

8

I took it with a grain of salt as well, that is why I said “claims”, though knowing Pál Király and his dedication to his work, it’s plausible.

Besides, I don’t see why Hungary would have exaggerated in a secret military document.

9

Its damage is already higher. 6.6, while the MP-40 has 5.8.

2 Likes
10

I’m not a gun expert, but I have had my share of weapons training and I would say I don’t think a lot of the weapons stats in this game are probably anywhere close to reality. :wink:

1 Like
11

Mp34(ö) has 5.7 damage
Mp40 has 5.8 damage
Mp35/I has 6.0 damage

All them fire the same 9x19 parabellum. It’s game mechanics logic I guess.
But the 9x25 Mauser export is actually closer to the 45.acp used by Thompsons and those do 6.8 damage and have much less damage drop over distance.

2 Likes
12

That is true, it’s impossibile to give 1:1 representation of weapons, but I would like their in game characteristics to reflect their real world performance as much as possible without breaking the game.

1 Like
13

7.62x25 is similar to 9x19, but its damage is even lower.

14

Pps42 has 5.6 damage
Mp40 has 5.8 damage and Mp38 has 5.7 damage.
That seems reasonable to me especially if you consider that Pps42 has a bigger magazine and higher DPS.

Though it’s also worth noting that Mp41(r) firing 9mm parabellum only achieves 6.8 damage while the norm for max upgraded weapons firing parabellum is 6.9-7 damage so Darkflow probably recognises both Soviet weaponry and ammunition as lower standard quality.

1 Like
15

actually, in terms of gameplay only, Kiraly is already very unique. I’d prefer Kiraly over Conders MG, as Kiraly deals better dmg, while Conders is basically just an all-round buffed PPSh.

16

It’s a pity that they don’t recognize the poor quality of German armor.
In any case, this weapon already has high damage.

1 Like
17

The double standards here is absolutely shameless.

I asked for a 0.1 damage increase to compensate for a massive DPS loss.
You asked for a massive buff on the best TT weapon of the game.

6 Likes
19

Actually, Gaijin used to. Late war German tanks used to have a 0.98(iirc) armor modifier, and iirc some German tanks(and hilariously one British tank) had a chance of catching fire on non-penetrating hits.
In general, I don’t like it when devs try to model manufacturing issues. For example, T-34s and panthers had armor cracking issues. Easy enough to model, right? But that applies to HE rounds too, so how do you model that? Then you get to riveted armor - do you model the downsides of that? Basically at what point do you stop? Same with guns that had issues with jamming - should that be modeled?
I’d personally just give weapons their theoretical performance. It’s easier to do and you can always balance other factors(besides, damage itself in-game is used to balance weapons.)

1 Like
20

how does this manifest itself? in the fact that I asked a question? this is not a suggestion , if you haven’t noticed. or do you think that 7.9 damage is not enough? and 8.0 will be what is needed. but why?
This is 1 more than the MP40, 0.8 more than the most powerful cartridge 9.19.

21

I would probably say when it comes to this topic it’s thanks to all the hidden modifiers or the concept of body armor or Fedorov.

No and they have a whole bunch of hidden modifiers and artificial buffs.