Ojective imbalances after nerfs / introduction of new weapons

Archive Suggestions - Archive
1

After the last major update, a multitude of new weapons were introduced, as well as balances for existing weapons. However, I feel like these changes have resulted in what is an objectively unfair balance in favor of the russian teams:

Russia gets the Mosin M91/30 rifle, the M91 Dragoon, the M1895 and the Diakonov, which all deal 15 damage, when reaching army level 2, 3, 13 and 17 respectively.
Germany only gets the Schiessbecher at level 17 in terms of 15 damage rifles, meaning they always deal 2 or 3 points less damage than the russian teams, which is just blatant favoritism towards russia. Even if one arguid that the 7.62mm round from Russia has more bullet energy, the 7.92mm round from Germany is larger, which in return would mean it would deal more damage if the bullet energy was the same, evening it out.

The russian SMG, the PPD-34/38 (box), has a rate of fire of 730-800 shots per minute and deals 6 damage per shot. This is unchanged compared to the previous version. In the meanwhile the germans get the MP 28, which deals only 5.5 damage (nerfed from 8.5 before!) at a mere 450-490 shots per minute (while the previous default SMG, the MP 35, had a much higher rate of fire of around 600 shots per minute).

At level 5, the russians get access to the TOZ-B shotgun, which is actually the Luftwaffe M30 drilling, as can be seen by the 3 barrels, but the germans get the MP 38, which is perfectly identical to the MP 28 in every regard, including visual model, resulting in unneeded seperation between 2 identical guns for upgrade purposes for germany, as well as a lower ammount of playstyle customization for germany.

All of these issues result in the Russian SMG squads being massively superior compared to everything else, as the germans do not get access to a reliable one-shot bolt action rifle (like the Mosin M91/30) to possibly counter them, and the German SMG squads can get countered by the Mosin M91/30 thanks to its oneshot potential + the German SMGs having their DPS roughly halfed means the Russians have way more time to do so.

This is further worsened by the movement nerf preventing you from duking shots, allowing Russian players to easily land torso shots (can confirm this as I have used the Mosin M91/30 a fair ammount this update) but also allow their SMG squads to easily spray down hordes of enemies with their SMG.

Overall, combat has become extremely clunky for Germany because of these weaker weapons, while Russia effectively remains unchanged except for the movement nerf if you play SMG + M91/30. Thus, I suggest either reverting the weapon nerfs, or nerfing the russian bolt actions and SMGs to be in line with all other weapons in the game.

8 Likes
2

I don’t like the weapon changes at all. All we were asking for is Russians to be given an SMG that can be used at a good range. Somehow, the devs translated it to German guns are superior, we need to nerf them. Also, Germans missing out on a shotgun is baffling.

3

Germans are missing out on their* shotgun. The russians are using the German M30 Luftwaffe Drilling rn.

4

It was the same before the update. Someone brought it up a while ago. Don’t know why devs haven’t taken a look at it yet.

And I was playing Soviets all the way before reset and can confirm that Mosine Carbine is superior to the any German weapon of the same class since the update. An unbalance in arguably the most used class of weapons in the game is kinda bad news.

5

This update did a few damn good things right. But the weapons honestly feel a bit worse for the most part.

2 Likes
6

For me the default Mosin doesn’t one shot like it was previously doing, however on the M91/30 I agree.

7

Neither the default Mosin and default Gewehr 33 oneshot, but the kar98k deals only 13 damage while the 91/30 deals 15

2 Likes
8

The MP 28s visual model is incorrect, its just a MP40, the MP 28 irl looked alot similar to the MP35, also the weapon progressions and choice changes seems unnecessary (for germany Atleast), seeing as all the visual models for the german bolt actions are just Kar98ks, alot of weapons models are wrong, (MG13 for example), the balance has been thrown more out of wack this update, it adds some good stuff, but again, Weapon Progression and campaign progression seem clunky as you said.

9

This video gives a good visual of the MP-28, its side mounted magazine, and wooden stock are much different than the MP 40s design

10

I personally feel like having asymmetric balance in weapons is actually a good thing, as long as weapon parameters are based in technical accuracy. Things like fire-rate is an obvious thing to have historical, but damage should be as well.

It is difficult to say how to model damage of 9x19mm vs 7.62x25mm because the Russian cartridge actually packs a lot more power behind the bullet, but the bullet has a smaller cross section than the German’s 9mm, which means that it would have superior penetration, but lower stopping power.

Most full-powered rifles and machine guns though, I believe that they should all do the same 15 damage. Barrel length really doesn’t factor in a whole ton unless it is drastically shorter with a lot less muzzle velocity.

1 Like
11

after a couple of matches, i get used to. because it’s not that hard of trouble.
but in certain situations. you can really feel it since we were used to the old one.

and you really get the punch when you see an entire squad of russians looking at you made of 7/8 people. which, in a clip of 5 you might gonna kill 2/3 of those.

so yeah, now parameters are compleatly randomic for the german weapons.
check this:

i personally don’t like what they done with the weapons.
i still havn’t tested yet the g41.

2 Likes
12

Having the weapons not be the same on both sides is perfectly fine, as long as they can be considered sidegrades of each other instead of pure upgrades
Before, the russian SMGs had higher rate of fire but lower damage, leading to superior DPS when very close, but less DPS when around medium range. Now it just has more DPS no matter the range. And saying it’s harder to control doesnt really add up as that’s a skill related thing and you can always burst fire it if you have to.

2 Likes
13

A spot on appraisal of the changes. I’m all for balancing, and some of the changes: the T-60, the cap zones in invasion, ect. are great, but the weapons changes seem to be in the wrong direction

14

For me even with the very first match I was able to get my hand on Gewehr 33 (I believe 33/44), it was capable of oneshot at all distances rarely it ever not oneshot, consider that I tried it on enemy coming from their spawn. I don’t know why it is that & even recently Mosin 1907 was able sometimes (not that much) to oneshot at long range on enemy were coming from their spawn side, not idea what’s happening but that what I get.

15

Please try to play germany and use it as it really doesnt oneshot reliably. Otherwise you found a bug where picking up a gewehr 33 buffs its damage output.

1 Like
16

Some weapons were realistically better than others though, just having arbitrary stats to balance them as sidegrades detracts from the game imo. A weapon should be represented as technically accurate as possible in this kind of a game. Part of the point of Enlisted was to promote asymmetric gameplay iirc.

That’s not to say that realistic improvements can’t be made that would also help balance. It would be nice if they can find a way to nicely reconcile bullet energy vs bullet size (stopping power) to create a more realistic damage model. Things like bullet penetration should also be realistically refined as well.

There are even some other ideas I would like to see which can improve the gunplay overall as well (which I believe you have seen already) that could really add some depth to Enlisted.

1 Like
17

Could be the case but I would say both are bugged since I got oneshots with Mosin 1907 too, to me they are basically in the same category for me Gewehr 33 was the one that is more reliably getting the oneshots, not sure if it is the case on your side that default Mosin (1907) was more reliably getting oneshots than Gewehr.

Regardless the whole case should be looked.

18

I wouldn’t mind asymmetric if that ment one side having better SMGs but the other side better LMGs.
“Damage” is an arbitrary stat which is very hard to quantalize realistically so the devs have a lot of options there. Asymmetric should NEVER mean that one side just gets a flat out +20-30% DPS over the other.

19

both the 1907 and the gewehr do 12 damage, which was the same ammount as the DP-27/MG34 at the time, neither of which could reliably oneshot, but reliably 2-shot. All other bolt action rifles except for the M91/30 (which has 15) have 13 damage now, which should be in between reliable 2-shot and reliable 1-shot, but 13 damage isnt enough to oneshot on the torso. You need 14+ for that (a gewehr 33 with +20% damage upgrade has that and can oneshot on torso)

I never said I was getting more reliable oneshots with the 1907. I said that the M91/30 got way more reliable oneshots due to having +2 damage, though I was having good results with a picked up dragoon as well.

1 Like
20

Why the heck did the devs nerf the German smg, it had lower DPS than the PPD to begin with