Fair Assault rifles for all factions and AR overhaul

Hello bajtársak and fellow forum dwellers.

Today I would like to propose adding assault rifles to both Japan and Western Allies factions as well as overhauling the already existing Assault Rifles in game.

So what is an assault rifle? (definition based on the first successful AR, the StG44)
The assault rifle is a standard issue infantry weapon firing intermediate cartridges, capable of sustained automatic and semi-automatic firing without mounting the weapon.

A few examples to make sure we are on the same page:
RD-44 is not an assault rifle because it’s not a standard issue infantry weapon, it fulfils the role of a machine gun.
Fedorov Avtomat is not an assault rifle because it doesn’t fire intermediate cartridges.
Vetterli rifle is not an assault rifle because it isn’t capable of sustained automatic and semi-automatic firing.

I could go on, but the point is that these requirements are tough, the only mass-produced weapon of the second world war that fulfils the criteria is the StG44 while a few prototypes such as the AS-44 kind of fulfil these.
Instead of picking the weapons that fulfilled most of the given criteria, I chose weapons that at least feel authentic and are not just copy-pasted StG44s, still it will take some artificial balancing.

Western Allies:

M1944 Hyde Carbine
M1944_Hyde_Carbine_Aberdeen_Proving_Ground

A prototype carbine designed by the famous American weapon designer George Hyde in 1944.
It is fed from a 20 or 30 round magazine and fires 30.carbine cartridges with an impressive fire rate of 600-1200 rpm. This is the closest US weapon to the StG44.

Rieder automatic rifle
Reider

The Rieder automatic rifle was designed in South Africa, these are converted Lee-Enfield rifles. It doesn’t have a fire selector, however it is capable of firing single shots if the trigger is released quickly, suggesting that it has a fire rate of around 500-600 rpm.
The gun can be fed by a 30 round Bren magazine and fires 303.British which are full power rifle cartridges just like the 6.5 Arisaka fired by the Fedorov Avtomat.
However it should be considered that the 303. is not much stronger than the 6.5 Arisaka and converted weapons usually lose some of the power of the original design.

Japan

Japan did actually have an intermediate cartridge in the form of 6.5x30mm Type 95 cartridge.
A prototype chambered in it did exist, the Type 2A SMG chambered in 6.5x30mm Type 95.


There are no surviving weapons or pictures of it, only a description.
The picture matches the description.
It may have had around 600 rpm and probably either a 30 or 35 round magazine.

Japan doesn’t have another assault rifle of its own.
But it did get its hands on two assault rifles.

Japan had purchased 6 StG44s and also acquired a Fedorov Avtomat

Any of these two could be added, neither is ideal.
Fedorov Avtomat would probably make more sense since Japan was producing 6.5mm arisaka rounds, but not 8mm kurz.

Classic assault rifles: StG44; AS-44; (and their variants) M1944 Hyde Carbine; Type 2A SMG chambered in 6.5x30mm Type 95;
automatic rifles: Fedorov Avtomat; Rieder automatic rifle;

Weapon characteristics
I did some calculations to suggest what characteristics these guns should have, just so neither of them are too weak or too strong (Im looking at you Type Hei Automatic rifle)
Note that all guns are max upgraded!

Classic assault rifles:

StG44: rate of fire: 650rpm base damage at 10m: 9.6 - at 100m: 7.5
Damage per second at 10m: 104 DPS - at 100m: 81 DPS
Reload time: 2.6 magazine size: 30

AS-44: rate of fire: 660rpm base damage at 10m: 9.6 - at 100m: 7.5
Damage per second at 10m: 105 DPS - at 100m: 82,5 DPS
Reload time: 2.7 magazine size: 30

Hyde model 1944: rate of fire: 700rpm base damage at 10m: 9.2 - at 100m: 7.0
Damage per second at 10m: 107 DPS - at 100m: 81 DPS
Reload time: 2.5 magazine size: 30

Type 2 6.5x30 type 95: rate of fire: 630rpm base damage at 10m: 9.4 - at 100m: 7.2
Damage per second at 10m: 99 DPS - at 100m: 76 DPS
Reload time: 2.2 magazine size: 35

Dispersion actually needs to be overhauled for assault rifles because it makes no sense that the cheap Horn StG has less dispersion than the state of the art StG44.
The Mkb, StG, AS-44 and AT-44 families should have around 0.40 and 0.55 dispersion, the better the gun the better should the dispersion get.

Automatic rifles:

To up keep immersion, automatic rifles have slightly more damage, less dispersion and minor damage drop over distance than assault rifles, but they also have more recoil and longer reload time.

Fedorov Avtomat: rate of fire: 600rpm base damage at 10m: 10.0 - at 100m: 8.6
Damage per second at 10m: 100 DPS - at 100m: 86 DPS
Reload time: 2.9 magazine size: 25

Rieder automatic rifle: rate of fire: 560rpm base damage at 10m: 10.5 - at 100m: 9.0
Damage per second at 10m: 98 DPS - at 100m: 84 DPS
Reload time: 3.1 magazine size: 30

If Automatic rifles did more damage than 10.5 then they would be clear meta over assault rifles.

Automatic rifles should have dispersion between: 0.30-0.40 so they are more accurate than assault rifles but less accurate than select fire rifles.

Thank you for your time and attention!

9 Likes

How about the Riberolle carbine? Same legacy of the Great War as the Fedorov.

So how is it better than the m2 carbine? (Yeah, i know. m2 irl is not a very good gun).

I just need the T20 to be less of dog doo doo
Why is it so damn innacurate
Why does it deal so little damage

Differency is ~800-1000J
.303 has about same energy as modern 7.62 nato.
It really is full size / power rifle round, while arisaka as well is full size rifle round it has by far less energy.

stock dmg ? As 3* fedorov has 12.6

it is a rifle, and definitely shouldnt have less than avs that has stock 13 dmg & 3* 15 something.

Theres alot room to increase full auto rifles recoil.

I would much prefer the hyde bendix model. It looks better. But overall i think hyde is the way to go for allies. Is by far the most commented suggestion.

hydecarbine10

Yes the Ribeyrolls 1918 as well as the Burton model 1917 were also considered.

It’s true that the Ribeyrolls does fire intermediate cartridge and is capable of full-auto and semi-auto firing, however it had serious reliability issues and thus it was functionally not capable of sustained fire thus it’s development was terminated in 1921 which is why I picked the Hyde model 1944 instead which feels more authentic because it’s a WW2 design, though I do believe that the Ribeyrolls 1918 is unique enough to have space in the game at hands of a French squad once subfactions get an update.

On a side note for the people wondering why the Burton model 1917 was not chosen either is because it was designed as an AA machine gun and I felt like that an automatic rifle would be more authentic.

No, it is not.

Im pretty sure these are different models.
We don’t even know for sure if the type 1 even existed.

"Fair Assault rifles " is a lazy and bad idea.
Each faction has their own unique weapons, copy weapons will only ruin the characteristics of those faction.

And this thing is not even an AR. Lewis assault phase rifle will be better.

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We don’t need fictional weapons in Enlisted.

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I actually did my best to make each assault rifle as unique as possible.
I played around with damage, fire rate and reload time as much as I could but there is a limit how strong or weak the weapons can be for BR5 hence the “fair” title.

Too bad the e.m.1/e.m.2. Weren’t made a year or two earlier

All of the guns I suggested were real, it’s the sources are that are spotty.
In my honest opinion only Germany should have had ARs, but that ship sailed long ago.

Indeed it could have been a fun addition to the game.

They could add them as gold orders or event weapons/squad. Or probably the best let us to transfer up to 5 of them from the Soviets/Germany like we could with the campaigns just by paying bronze orders, now it could be just silver.

Im glad you asked, the Hyde 1944 does more damage, has faster reload and will probably have less recoil than the M2C, though M2C has far less dispersion than ARs so it wont get completely overshadowed.

still the 303. is far less powerful than other rounds used in WW2 rifles.
6.5x50mm_Japanese_with_.303_British_&_.30-06
Arisaka in the center, 303. to the left and 30-06. Springfield to the right.
The 7,92x57mm Mauser is even more powerful.
Besides these Lee-Enfield rifles are converted guns, dont expect them to do the same magic anymore.

The Mosin-Nagant, SVT-38 and 40, AVS-36, DP-27 all fire the same 7.62×54mmR, but they all have different damage, dispersion and recoil. This is artifical balancing, a necessary bad.

damage needs overhaul, if automatic rifles do anymore damage than 10.5 even max upgraded than they will completely outperform actual ARs which is the last thing we want.

comparison

current AS-44 and Fedorov Avtomat:

Fedorov Avtomat: rate of fire: 600rpm base damage at 10m: 12.6 - at 100m: 9.8
Damage per second at 10m: 126 DPS - at 100m: 98 DPS
Reload time: 3.0 magazine size: 25

The Fedorov is clearly the better gun even though its unlocked earlier in the tech tree.
Absolute madness.

Dont tell me you seriously expect Fedorov to have rifle damage and dispersion, while also having AR recoil and ammo reserve. That would be exteremely over powered.

There is a lot of room to increase SF rifle recoil as well, it was attempted to balance automatic weapons that way but it didnt work and the change was reverted back.

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Slightly more J than 30-30 or 30-06
Quite similar with 7.62x54R

Arguably only oddball is the 8mm mauser which has significantly more J.

And I dont really mind it.
Point being all of them currently has more dmg than suggested 10.5?
So I assume we’re speaking of nerfing all the current full auto rifles ?

Its soviet TT, kinda self-explanatory imo.
Im more surprised it doesnt shoot rockets.

More recoil less dispersion please
It’s like most semiautos in the game were made using rocks
and then they were ran over by a tank
3 times

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I am not sure about it I found on reddit the photo
type-2a-1934-for-japan-br-v-assaulter-v0-219uwx4mh5vc1