Balance changes to PPS 42 and 43

[EVA_Evo]

Its not these guns breaking the balance, its body armour.

[TheSaboteur59]

The Germans have something that could potentially eliminate this imbalance in the form of Soviet body armor. It has been in the editor for a long time.

[Comet92220]

Ah yes let’s give body armor to any faction so that only people who are aware of their existence (and who can afford their price) can actually play the game.

[S-G-44]

add body armor for all nations, remove it from the game, give penalties by its use but obviously the armor is the main problem when it comes to balance of low br

but one thing is 100% sure at least when it comes to my POV, body armor for all nations wouldnt stadisticly fix anything

[EVA_Evo]

Body armour doesnt really affect any of the Soviet weapons, there is only a few guns that would care. We should be trying to REMOVE body armours damage reduction, not add it to everyone

[TheSaboteur59]

Lol, body armor doesn’t really affect the game that much when I play for Germany on the same 1BR or 2BR, and the Soviets often don’t get much help from their body armor. All a body armor does is SOMETIMES save your life, but only sometimes.
Their body armor didn’t save them, I shot them all anyway.

[TheSaboteur59]

Nevertheless, if this German body armor is in the editor, it means that sooner or later it will be used in the game.

[EVA_Evo]

Body Armour should be purely cosmetic, remove the 10% damage reduction from it

It has been long enough that the Soviet Body armour ruins the balance of the game. Body armour (and for that 1 Japan squad too) should have its damage reduction taken away. You should not be able to gain an advantage from a cosmetic (helmets are fine though, since their impact is so negligible). My proposal is this Remove the damage reduction from body armour Additionally, refund all tickets spent on them. If a person has paid for 25 body armour vests, put 25x6 (or whatever the cost is) ticket…

[CaptainSebekel]

Probably as premium or event by looking at Japan or the super helmet.

@TheSaboteur59

Their body armor didn’t save them, I shot them all anyway.

No wonder since they are ill-suited against rifles in almost all cases.

[OggeKing]

@ForlorN

PPS 42 should fire at the rate of 500

@ForlorN

PPS 43 should become today’s PPS 42 and fire at the rate of 600

Weapon stats should be based on real world (specificly historical) performances of weapons, if you got a source for these RoF changes then by all means, I support it.

On this topic of sources, Chris McNab writes in the “Soviet Submachine Guns of World War II” that the “PPS” has a rate of fire of 650rpm** (he does not deffirantiate between models, maybe he’s right to do so in terms of RoF idk), and the PPSh-41 900rpm* (oof for Soviets if true).

These stats of the PPS family he claims comes directly from the translation of the official Soviet manual by one Major James F. Gebhardt, sadly I don’t have access to this document, though I did find the original Russian manual of which it was translated from, I tried to read it but as it turns out I can’t read Russian.

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Soviet Submachine Guns of World War II : Chris McNab : Free Download, Borrow,...

*Page 32
**Page 34

Anyone else want to have a crack at this?

PPSH Technical Manual : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Edit: just noticed, this is the PPSH manual, heh yeah I can’t read Russian, good luck to anyone trying to find the actual manual!

[EVA_Evo]

@OggeKing

Weapon stats should be based on real world (specificly historical) performances of weapons

This doesn’t always lead to a good balance of gameplay, which is more important than what a museum thinks. The guns should be balanced within Enlisted, for Enlisted, for a better health of the game.

[Mortarion_Death]

@ForlorN

A solid option equivalent to MP 40/Beretta M1.

what about damage? How is 6.7 damage equivalent to 7.0 damage?

[OggeKing]

Then maybe the game has some thinking to do when it comes to advantaging high rate of fire weapons, because if it really was so good in real life this would be the norm, but we both know (I hope) that most historical SMGs at the time had a RoF of around 500rpm.

Anyway, I think being real to history is better, then balance around that, and we both know the Devs really only consider changes if you got sources to back them up, so there’s that as well. Not often me and the devs agree on how the game should be run.

[Mortarion_Death]

@Comet92220

Ah yes let’s give body armor

If the Axis player doesn’t mention the cuirass, you need to check his pulse, he’s most likely dead.

[TheSaboteur59]

I beg to differ. Recreating accurate weapon characteristics is Enlisted’s feature. Once, my friend @_DELAVR said:

@_DELAVR_

What? Let me remind you that we have real weapons from World War II in the game with real characteristics.

And I completely agree with that.

[GeneralBrus]

@Comrade Sina

The Germans got buffed, the Americans got the M1A1, and the Japanese already had a great SMG. The problem right now is not the PPS, it’s the Uragan, I believe it should be buffed and moved to BR3.

Well PPS wouldn’t be as unfair if Soviets wouldn’t have body armor - as 2 hit kill MP40 vs 3 hit kill PPS sounds fair enough, Uragan however is simply waaay too good for BR2.

I think the devs should really put their efforts together and prioritising on body armor, because a nerf to PPS should be discussed AFTER a body armor rework, otherwise this entire issue will get too complicated.

[Valkay]

@Mortarion_Death

How is 6.7 damage equivalent to 7.0 damage?

Not an issue since less than 6.8 damage will down in 3 shots and also kill with high chance in 3 shots.
While 6.8 or more damage will always down in 2 shots and kill in 4 shots.
Its just how down state works (a weird mechanic tbh)
So the higher damage guns need to spend more time on a single target.

Lanchester that has 6.8 damage and 690 max upgraded has been BR2 for as long as I can remember and no one has complained about it, besides maybe Dregomz.

[GeneralBrus]

@Mortarion_Death

If the Axis player doesn’t mention the cuirass, you need to check his pulse, he’s most likely dead.

Dont make fun of me, those armor plates give me a high pulse for sure.

[Mortarion_Death]

@Valkay

Not an issue since less than 6.8 damage will down in 3 shots

Mathematics is a Soviet pseudoscience. 6.8+6.8=13.6 no?

[Comet92220]

@Mortarion_Death

6.8+6.8=13.6 no?

That’s… exactly what he said :

@Valkay

While 6.8 or more damage will always down in 2 shots