Regarding Enlisted and War Thunder infantry mode

Mess Room
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Wall of text incoming, sorry about that, lol.

We know that war thunder will get an infantry mode with gear that starts at the korean war era. It is quite obvious that gaijin doesn’t want war thunder to walk on enlisted’s toes, which is logical. By that logic, there obviously won’t be any korean war (and beyond) stuff that will come to enlisted.

But then, what about the future content for enlisted ? We won’t be getting anything that comes after ww2, the ww1 april fools event in enlisted just uses the assets of war thunder’s last year april fools event that was also about ww1, and even if ww1 is introduced to enlisted someday, most of the ww1 weapons are already into the game, so there won’t be much new weapons. There wouldn’t be much more tanks either, obviously because of historical reasons and also because enlisted’s tanks and planes are just the models that were made by war thunder’s teams, so if war thunder’s teams don’t make them, then there won’t be much ww1 tanks and planes in enlisted.

Whether we get ww1 or not one day, what else can we get in the future in enlisted ? The devs don’t really want to give us any new nations (which is funny, because ww1 western front was mainly between France, UK, and Germany, and we don’t have the first two ingame, so the devs would be forced to introduce new nations if they chose to officially introduce ww1); most of the iconic weapons, tanks and planes from ww2 are already in the game. You can clearly see that the last update was very thin in terms of content for each tree: we got in total 3 weapons, including 2 premium, and they are all variations of already existing weapons, 2 tanks, and 1 plane. The devs are clearly running out of weapons to add to the trees (or they choose to sell the new stuff as premiums, lol), and the same can be said about vehicles, because as I said, they just come from war thunder. A quick look at war thunder’s wiki will show you that there aren’t much more vehicles left to add.

So what content can come to the game in the future ?
New maps ? Yes, of course, but we basically get one map each year and that’s it, and additionally, you can get quickly bored of it, especially if the map is not well designed.
New classes ? Same story as the equipment and vehicle ones, the devs seem to be running out of things to add, especially when we see the latest class that was added with the mixed feelings from the players about it.
That just leaves new events, which is fine, but if the rewards are uninteresting, or if the event is too grindy/boring, there really won’t be a lot of incentive to play the game at all, especially if you’ve already unlocked everything in the trees.

So I am going to say something controversial: Shouldn’t we just ask for enlisted to merge with war thunder and become a part of the war thunder infantry mode ?

From what I can see, the feedback about the latest test of war thunder’s infantry mode is very positive, especially about the 64 vs 64 players mode: war thunder can afford to do such modes because they have a huge player base, and sadly, enlisted is still stuck with the equivalent of a small fraction of war thunder’s playerbase, and the numbers of enlisted players just seem to be stagnating at best (which could also be attributed to the fact that the content delivery has been very meagre lately). Enlisted having a small playerbase, it cannot afford to make the same 64 vs 64 players mode, and since the game is out, we are still stuck with those stupid bot squads. I know that the devs have always tried to improve things in that regard, but bots are still underwhelming overall. I don’t know if war thunder will have these two separate modes (one with bot squads and the other with only real players), but the “players only mode” in enlisted is not that great honestly, for a variety of reasons, one of which being the fact that the teams seem to be too small in my opinion, which is understandable, because the playerbase isn’t big enough to make the same 64 vs 64 mode like in war thunder

Now, with all these things in mind, what do you think about this proposition ?

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Well some TT tanks and planes are locked behind a paywall in War Thunder, like the Panzer 3 N. And Premium tanks in enlisted are TT in war thunder, like the Panzer 3 M. So I’m not sure how that would work.
And some players might play war thunder already, so how would the merge work? Will they keep their Premium squads? Or will they be forced to buy them again?

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I guess that in case of a merge you could get a GE compensation if you have a tank that is a premium in enlisted and a tt vehicle in wt, and you could get the premium vehicle in wt if you have obtained the tt vehicle in enlisted. Compensations for premium time already exists in both games, and the ww2 premium vehicles in wt aren’t the most expensive, and the enlisted playerbase is quite small compared to the wt one.

In my opinion, everything points to the fact that enlisted will soon be a dead end: we won’t get anything after ww2, most ww1 weapons are already in the game in the case we get ww1 one day, and we will likely never get more factions either.

So that leaves just two things: new maps and events. We tend to have one new map each year, so it is very slow, and for the events, half of the weapons rewards are weapons from past BPs or already existing weapons with slightly different skins.

I love this game, but if these are the only things we’re going to get in the coming years, then I think the future of this game is looking quite bleak, because obviously it won’t attract many new players, and the playerbase will just slowly bleed out, because players will have unlocked everything, and there won’t be any meaningful content added.

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Please refrain from discussing War Thunder on Enlisted. World War I and World War II are the issues relevant to Enlisted. Furthermore, the development team is currently working on a new project for War Thunder; that’s their own business. Enlisted only needs to maintain its own game content. If you like War Thunder, play War Thunder. If you like Enlisted, offer constructive suggestions and spend money on it. Don’t treat things that don’t exist as established facts; otherwise, I’ll have to consider you a troublemaker for War Thunder.

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I can’t emphasize it enough: Enlisted is the better kid in the room.

War Thunder has so many issues inherited and many of them are no long solvable, for example the ground RB mode is entirely broken, and the compression problem which, despite the loud voice of community, isn’t getting solved for years, maybe for 5 years at this point.

This is yet to mention the fact that WT is 5 times more grindy and that entire game and their team is greedy as F, they can absolutely choose to not care about their player’s experience when they could grab money by releasing OP content, if you played the game before you know they intentionally make everything freshly released OP, so that players are forced to grind new things, or just pay for the quick access; By the time the majority of the players have it they’ll just nerf it up in preparation of new contents. Also, most of the premium vehicles are just blatantly OP, period.

I’m glad that Enlisted on the most part don’t have those BS. People complain about this game yes, but this is nothing, not remotely close to how WT is. If anything WT shouldn’t thread in Enlisted’s water and I’d much much prefer to play cold war and modern warfare in this game. Enlisted’s devs are way more creative, they tune balances way better, they release more thoughtful contents despite the visible lacks of resources compare with WT. The maps of this game is just gorgeous both artistically and game-play wise, and as a game dev myself I can assure you guys that these maps are just about the best you’ll get anywhere.

Please god (Snail god?) I love this game, don’t make it merge into WT, and please grant this game with a bright future, I don’t want to see the potential of this game wasted just to satiate the money hungry WT.

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I played WT for a year or so, but got tired of it strictly being a vehicle game. Then I found Enlisted four plus years ago and have only fired up WT a couple times. I haven’t played WT, just fired it up to see what has changed. When they get the infantry up for all, I will try it, but I currently have it uninstalled since it is a Steam game and I am conserving my hard drive space.

As far as WW1 goes. I think Gaijin should keep it as a permanent BR level, but then they would also feel the need to add more maps, which would take time away from them adding any future WW2 maps like Iwo Jima, Saipan, Okinawa, Manila and some European maps.

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Problem is, devs who make the maps aren’t the same as the one who make weapons, the ones who make vehicles (which are wt devs in this case). And at the moment, we’re basically at a rhythm of one new map per year basically. And I doubt that this pace of map releases will attract new players or even help the game keep its playerbase, for example I just played Manchuria for the first time this morning. Was it good ? Yeah that was good, but I won’t try to play this map to death either. The thing that made me come back in the recent days after months of not playing the game is the ww1 event, which is just the recycling of last year’s wt april fools event (and technically, wt did ww1 a year before enlisted) and when you see last year’s enlisted april fools event, which was basically the recycling of cuisine royale assets with a game mode that was just mid at best, we can’t say that the enlisted devs have been very creative lately. The original team (darkflow) is gone and we’re just left with a reduced team. Two years ago, we had a roadmap for the year, but now we have nothing, and we’re at the point where we can count the overall additions to the trees on one hand’s fingers. If content continues to be delivered at this pace, then the game will just see its playerbase slowly bleed out, and the problems are that there isn’t much content left to add in the trees, because we won’t go beyond ww2, and even if there was still plenty of content to add, the teams making content for the game seem to be way too reduced to deliver in meaningful volumes. And it’s not the gambling boxes available for a short time after each update that will make me come back, at least for me personally. With all this in mind, I have no idea how the future of this game could be bright. Enlisted doesn’t seem to have become the cash cow that gaijin wanted it to be, and it doesn’t seem that they will invest in this game more, especially when we see that they’re adding infantry to wt now.

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You’ve described at least 5 more maps, and at this rate, it will take at least 5 years to see them all added to the game if they keep this pace.

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And that, my friend, hurts, because it is the fact.

No sure where this game will be going towards, but the current state indeed doesn’t look good.

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TBH, I doubt most of those maps, if any will ever be added.

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The thing is Gaijin seems to really wanna make their gamble by putting all the fruits in one basket which is WT. As a huge studio this is arguably a horrible choice as there could be many reason why a game could end up in pitfall, not to mention that WT is already a problematic game to fix.

As for what I could see, WT devs are spending the majority of their time trying to fix issues instead of creating new content, as the current economy system, matchmake/BR system, maps, and game modes all have problems. I could make a list of it as a long-time player.

It’s like history in repeats, seeing WT now is like see WOT in 2014. Putting infantries in WT will grant it all the existing problems WT already face, like trying to kill a health person (Enlisted) just to transplant his healthy organ into a dying person (WT). (Sry this is a horrible example, but it really fits here).

This is a really bad from move Gaijin, it’s not worth it. Not at all.

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Why would Enlisted ever want to move past WW2?
90% of the player base is specifically here for the ultimate WW2 experience and there is so much more the developers can still add.
The game should focus on improving existing subfactions and add new ones too.
We could get a year´s worth of updates just with British and Italian vehicles that are yet to be added to the game.

In fact there are still countless iconic weapons and vehicles that are yet to be added:
Stuka G, RPzB 54/1, SU-122, T-44, KV-85, Sten mk.V, M4A3 w(76), A6M2 Type 0 Model 21 (most common Zero), A6M5 Type 0 Model 52 (best mass-produced Zero), these the first that came to my mind but others can surely name some more too.

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I would personally love to see whole new factions added to the game, but there doesn’t seem to be any indication that the devs are going to do that. One of the reasons might be that if they have a reduced team, it would probably require a lot of work from them. I know that UK and Italy are already in the US and German tree, but I will never be satisfied with this solution.

For the new weapons, apart from the sten mk v, which doesn’t seem to be in the game at all, everything else is already kinda here: the two other panzerschreck variants (with the shield) are already in the game, but only in the mission editor, a quick look at enlisted imfdb will prove it.

For the vehicles, well, they all come from wt, I have NEVER seen a new vehicle being added to enlisted first and wt after. A quick look at wt wiki will just show you what we can expect in the future, because indeed, all the vehicles in enlisted are just models coming from wt, the enlisted devs don’t seem to be making vehicles at all (which is understandable, if you have other devs more experienced in that matter working on a game specifically made around vehicles, you ask them do it, because they will make these better and quicker than you, that’s just logical). Even vehicles with no armament like the trucks/APCs are vehicles from wt, they just used the armed vehicles variants that are in wt that used these chassis and removed the weaponry to make these. Even simple things like the jeeps we find on maps in enlisted or even the bikes were already present in wt before, but they are just objects you can crush with your tank in some wt maps.

My point is, all the vehicles you’ve talked about are already present in wt, so it wouldn’t have required a lot of work to put them in enlisted, I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that they could have just added them all to enlisted in the last update. My guess is that they are keeping them in store to dripfeed us with these because they don’t have much more vehicles to add anymore. Just look at the japanese tanks for example, there are like 5 or 6 tanks left to add in total to enlisted when you look at wt wiki, with more than half of those being just SPAAGs or tanks from the 20s/30s that weren’t used much or at all during ww2. I guess we can expect the Ho Ni II to come to enlisted at some point, because it was added during the last wt update, but apart from that, there aren’t much vehicles left to add even for other nations, and especially when we’re talking about tanks.

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Thats just you, I really enjoy having a mix of German and Italian squads at the same time. There are many Italian weapons and vehicles that were used by Germans and the same is true the other way around, also Italians fought together with Germans in almost all of their campaigns, even in Greece and North Africa the Italians received German support so there is absolutely no reason to separate them.

The only subfaction that could be separated is the British empire but even then, there is little to be gained.
US faction would become a bit more realistic and depressing (losing half of its BR1-2 equipment and all BR2 LMGs).

French, Hungarian, Bulgarian, Siamese, Romanian, Finnish, Dutch, Chinese, Spanish etc guns.
There are plenty of guns to add to the game, dont worry.

some vehicles were specifically made for Enlisted, like the Flammpanzer II and OT-26, plus most APCs.
It is perfectly possible that its the War Thunder devs that borrowed to make them.

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For the weapons, I was just talking about the ones you mentioned.

For the flame tanks, yes the Flammpanzer II is unique, but the T-26 flame tank is just a regular T-26 with a modified turret.

For the APCs, I disagree, because all of them come from wt, the only unique ones I can think of are the Bren Carrier and the Ho Ha.

For example, here is what these vehicles are in Enlisted and how they were “converted” from wt models:

-Sdkfz 251 : comes from one of the armed versions used in wt, with the armament removed from the model

-Sdkfz 7 : comes from the Sdkfz 6/2 SPAAG from wt, with the gun removed and seats placed instead

-M3A1 : comes from one of the armed versions used in wt, with the armament removed from the model

-GAZ : comes from one of the armed versions used in wt, with the armament removed from the model

-LVT : comes from the LVT tank, with the turret and roof removed and a classic superstructure placed instead

-Studebaker : comes from the katyusha from wt, with the mlrs removed and a classic superstructure placed instead

-Type 94 (this one is even more obvious): comes from the Type 94 SPAAG from wt, with the gun removed and seats placed instead. When it was released, it even still had the wheels of the 20 mm gun carriage fixed behind the cabin, fortunately, the model was fixed afterwards.

And even the jeeps (normal and amphibious), kubelwagen, GMC truck, and even the german sidecar were models that were already in wt, but they were just objects that could just be crushed on some wt maps.

With that logic in mind, in terms of japanese tanks for example, there are just a few left from wt that aren’t in enlisted yet, and I’m not even sure they will be added for various reasons. These tanks/vehicles are :

-Ho Ro: japanese equivalent of the 15 cm sIG 33 B Sfl; could be added

-Ho Ni II: a Ho Ni with a 105 mm, was added to wt during the last update, so obviously enlisted wouldn’t have gotten it before; could be added

-Ro Go: heavy tank from the 30s, used in Manchuria but not in WW2, only one built, never entered production; unsure it could be added

-Ro Go exp.: conversion of the previous tank into a SPG with a 120 mm gun, never saw combat, and like the previous tank, I’m not even sure if these vehicles hadn’t been scrapped before WW2; unsure it could be added

-I Go: one of the first indigenous japanese tanks, dates back from the 20s, used in limited numbers during ww2, but obviously it was completely obsolete; could be added, but wouldn’t be higher than BR 1

-Type 94: SPAAG truck; could be added, but I doubt that it will be added in the tt, likely just an event/premium vehicle, like the soviet one.

-So Ki: prototype SPAAG tank, never entered production; could be added, but it seems that the devs aren’t really in a hurry to add SPAAGs to regular trees

-Ha Go commander; just a regular Ha Go with a different skin, and a few smoke grenade launchers, that’s it; could be added, but very likely only as a premium/event vehicle

And that’s it, these are all the japanese tanks/vehicles we can expect in the short and medium term, and a good part of those could likely only be added as premium/event vehicles. And in the long term, I dont think the enlisted devs can do much about it anyway, because they basically just take what the wt devs make in terms of vehicles, and if they decide to not make any ww2 vehicles at all, then we won’t be getting anything else.

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Whether it’s possible or not, I like the idea of a merge of the two games.

Seems odd to have a game that is WW2 only, then another game for everything after (or before). Certainly they have a logical reason to keep them separate but Im not sure what that is. But from a consumer perspective, why have two games downloaded when we only need one?

A merge could only lead to exponential gains for Enlisted. A bigger player base, much more content and most importantly, much more attention from the developers.

Without a merge, Enlisted will probably just remain in obscurity.

Though I doubt anything like this will happen. Gaijin just recently released Aces of Thunder, a standalone title whose VR features probably should/could have been totally incorporated into Warthunder.

Maybe that’s the strategy after all. Release a less sought after game with new mechanics, Then take the lessons learned and reincorporate those now fleshed out mechanics into Warthunder.

So yeah overall, it really feels like Enlisted was just Gaijins way of learning how to include infantry into Warthunder. And now we’re told that Enlisted is WW2 only to make us feel like we’re special, and not just their guinea pigs.

Not complaining, just guessing. I don’t really know man.

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Warthunders probably gonna take anyone who wanted “Realistic Battle mode” in Enlisted. Especially when it encompasses WW 2. No reason not to expect it to do so eventually.

I have played all of the tests

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Yeah, we even had an event in enlisted a few years ago (november 2021 to be precise) about guess what ? Modern warfare. It was exactly what you can expect: a prototype of war thunder infantry mode. It was basically just like the first infantry mode test done in war thunder a few months ago: modern gear and AI squads (just like enlisted), we had modern tanks (abrams and t-80), but the difference was the fact that we didn’t have any planes/helicopters/drones, unlike wt. It really just feels like enlisted, and also cuisine royale to some extent (never played that one though) were just stepping stones for war thunder infantry mode. If war thunder decides to introduce ww2 infantry stuff one day to their game (not planned now, it will start at the korean war era), then you know it will be the final nail in the coffin for enlisted. Until then, and if it comes to this one day, I’m pretty sure that enlisted will just stay in this kind of vegetative state we’re in at the moment : neither truly dead nor alive.

And I also agree that wt devs have way more resources and a huge playerbase to make some changes viable and more quickly: for example, the first test of wt infantry was similar to enlisted because it had the squad system with the stupid bots, players said that bot squads were ass, and for the second test, the devs went like: “here, we removed the bots squads and gave you a 64 vs 64 players mode, enjoy” and all of this in a very short time. In enlisted, we’re still stuck with the retarded bots since the release of the game, some fixes were made, but it’s still ass overall. And even if the enlisted devs decided to make a 64 vs 64 mode, I’m not even sure that this would work, because there might just not be enough players to fill a game with players with a gear of approximately the same br overall, because the playerbase of enlisted is just too small for such big modes.

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The funny thing here, is the fact that during the korean war, a ton of weapons that were used by the two sides were also used during ww2. A ton of american, soviet (used by North Korean and China), and even japanese (captured during ww2, or taken after Japan’s surrender) firearms were used during this conflict: mosin, ppsh, pps, tokarev, dp/dt, maxim, m1911, thompson, garand, m1/m2/m3 carbine, grease gun, springfield, m1919, bar, arisaka… all of these were used during this war. So, even if wt doesn’t want to walk on enlisted’s toes, they will necessarily have to. From there, they can just add a few older weapons, some ww2 maps, and here you go, you have your ww2 infantry mode in wt.

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Exactly, too many aspects of Enlisted do just seem like stepping stones towards Warthunder Infantry.

And it is a bit disheartening to see all of the love WTI is receiving. The developers are actively taking steps to try and capture the Battlefield fanbase. All while very little steps are being made under the Enlisted leadership.

One thing is certain, if WTI does win over the BF fanbase, it will just be a short time before they ask for WW2 content. And restarting their progress through playing Enlisted will probably be outright rejected.

A merge or absorption is probably the only hope Enlisted has. And I’d rather they pull the plug instead of leaving us in a vegetative state.

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