How long would the reload have to be with 800 RPM (according to some stats) for you guys to consider not always choosing the PPD over PPSh?
What if you actually had to cosplay a peasant conscript trying to fiddle the mag’s tower in the well properly with frozen hands-kind of slow?
What if the recoil/spread was bad enough because the conscript has to hold it by the drum?
No, because it would be very annoying to have an entire squad with body armor and PPD-34/38 but if the body armor is removed and the PPD-34/38 is nerfed I support it
If we break it down by individual stats: reload would likely have to be 5 seconds, dispersion would likely have to be equal to the Obrez.
It’s putting the weapon in a completely neutered state just to make a BR 4 SMG BR 3. I would rather give it some compromising stats but generally equal value to the PPD-40. Maybe the reload is slower due to the magazine geometry, but it gets better recoil?
Well, I don’t think we have historically accurate guns at all, do we?
As far as I know the same caliber has different damage numbers on different guns, Nagant revolver doesn’t kill a dude point blank, and MG-42 on SdKfz 251 overheats in 0.0001 seconds.
Not to mention stuff like PPSh Silenced and Hino Komuro, which most likely didn’t even exist in WW2, or the infamous Uragan, whose stats are only guessed and sugegsted, since most likely it was a one-off partisan thingy.
Well, here I’m coming from the opposite angle – personally I would like to see iconic WW2 stuff used ingame as much as possible (even with their worst/best case scenario stats for “balance”), with as few prototypes as possible (and never better than actual WW2 stuff).
its also a premium squad which inherently limits the amount of people using it as opposed to having free tech tree guns you can give to anybody who can equip an smg
UPD: Alternatively, what if we start with the Event/Lootbox PPD-34/38 snail drum nerfed and moved to BR3 first?
| Submachine Guns | Damage | Reload Timings (s) | Statcard Recoil | Effective Recoil | |||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Weapon Name | Obtained | BR | 10m | 100m | Velocity | Magazine | Reload | Alt Reload | Rate of Fire | Vertical | Horizontal | Recoil Control | Vertical | Horizontal | Dispersion |
| PPD-34/38 (Snail drum) | Silver Chest | IV | 6,4 | 3,2 | 450 | 75 | 2,7 | 2,16 | 860 | 18 | 11 | 0,4 | 7 | 4 | 0,70 |
I’d prefer to have all guns be represented as they should be in terms of magazine capacity, rate of fire, etc. I think it’s a tragedy when hard stats get skewed for “balance” just to shoehorn something where it belongs. This happened way too much with World of Tanks when it started alienating it’s fanbase around 2017 (for example, Conqueror UFP became 152mm instead of 130mm, when other game-specific stats could have been adjusted instead). Stuff like damage and reload speed within reason, recoil, dispersion, and other more nebulous stats make more sense than changing what makes a gun that gun.
I agree with all of the weapons you listed being off, they really should consider changing them, or making strong considerations before introducing said weapons in a half-assed way (at least the Hino can likely be model-swapped with the Watanabe rifle and keep the stats the exact same).
Kind of repeating myself on the last point, but if you have to change the identity of a weapon to make it fit a certain role, I don’t think it’s worth it. We can agree to disagree, but the developers seem keen on preseving historical rate of fire with all of the changes I’ve helped them make. For the most part, I think the Soviet SMGs are near-perfect in terms of how they are currently tiered and balanced, with some specific minor tweaks.
I agree with these hard stats.
And I don’t intend for PPD’s drum to hold fewer rounds or shoot slower than it’s (lowest possible) RoF.
However, reload time, spread, recoil, damage (drop) are ingame parameters which can be tweaked here and there, I believe.
Yes but it’s a shame that PPD-34/38 is basically the ugly duckling of the least played BR in the game.
(and PPSh-41 is stuck on fantasy BR with laser beams spam)
While stuff like Uragan (partisan made one-off) are widely and efficiently used.
Soviet SMGs are extremely similar, so anything at BR3 to create more tradeoffs is aok by me. Sure nerf it tons, it would be good variance at that BR.
Degtyarev PPD-30 inclusion into BR3 helped me lots getting bored to death, but it being a rare BP aint helping.
My favorite… comparing tech tree to premium.
I’ve done this once and now see how stupid it is from the other side.
Speaking speficially to the PPD-34/38 being the “ugly duckling” of the least played BR, I think that speaks more to how it’s been balanced, and the lack of incentives to play BR 4.
Again, I’d rather see the PPD-34/38 and PPD-40 be sidegrades, and BR 4 get some semi-auto buffs, and possibly even some XP/silver bonuses for playing it?
I’d say damage and recoil both are at minimum semi hard stats that have to be more carefully looked at than others. It makes very little sense for the same calibre, and I mean something like 7.62 Tokarev specifically not just every 7.62 calibre, fired from the same barrel length to do different amounts of damage. And, in my opinion, Recoil should be dependant on the calibre in question and it not being that way makes a weapon like the Fedorov Avtomat as strong as it is. A Rifle’s damage without a rifle’s recoil makes it far stronger than other Assault Rifles, especially now that a bayonet was added, while not having the drawbacks a weapon ike it has in real life.
@Veekay45 I understand you want to enjoy a PPD in moscow but I think putting drum mag SMGs in BR3 is going to open the gates for other factions asking for something similar and generally creating more powercreep in the whole game. You’ll get Americans asking for a drum mag thompson in BR3 and they’ll point to this
Precisely this.
Unless I’m mistaken and marrying the PPD-34/38 into the context of Moscow battles, where it historically was used isn’t what you’re specifically wanting, I doubt that would happen unless we got some sort of pseudo-campaign limited event. I can see campaigns returning as an optional mode if Enlisted was able to increase it’s population through meaningful change, and intelligent marketing.
Power creep Russia already have the best weapons for br3
I voted no because the most important aspect of a submachine gun in Enlisted is fire rate followed by magazine capacity.
You would need really big nerfs to make the PPD-34/38 BR3 worthy. Im not saying it wouldnt be possible but it would be easier and less controversial to give Soviets a new BR3 weapon with large magazine and mid-low fire rate.
If something needs to be heavily nerfed to the point it becomes slop just to fit that BR it just says a lot about how powerful the gun is
I’ve personally never liked that idea, especially here in this case where USSR has 2 excellent BR 3 smgs
My guy if you gotta break the entire skeleton of the gun to fit in a box… then it doesn’t belong in that box
in this case completely taking a perfectly fine BRIV smg basically destroying the gun so it can fit in brIII it shouldn’t be in that BR period
No. SMG powercreep should be reduced, not increased. I get what you’re saying but this just does not seem worth it, and it would be ideal to reduce powercreep before adding shiny new things, IMO.
They could add it as an option for custom battles, as was promised if I recall.
