Király historical accuracy buff

Valkay · December 30, 2025, 1:01pm

Hello Bajtársak and fellow forumdwellers,
The Király submachine gun was designed by Pál Király (or Király Pál in Hungarian name order). A Hungarian weapon designer who had previously worked for SIG in Switzerland.
His submachine was adopted by the Royal Hungarian army in 1939 and mass-produced by the Danuvia company in Budapest which is why it’s more commonly known as the Danuvia 39M.

The Király 39M was a ground breaking weapon for its time with its foldable magazine, rifle like appearance, delayed blowback operation and an unusually powerful cartridge for a submachine gun, the 9x25mm Mauser gave the weapon a most respectable effective range that rivaled short range carbines such as the M1 [carbine].

However, despite Király´s reputation, it is poorly represented in the game as a PPD-40 and Thompson M21/28 hybrid.

The bayonet

The Király 39M was originally adopted as a weapon of authority and the Hungarian gendarmerie was the most interested as they wanted a proud rifle like submachine gun with a bayonet, while the army was still skeptical about submachine guns in 1939, their interest was still centered on 9x19 guns like the Mp35/I.
However with Hungary’s entry into the war, the army quickly reconsidered its stance and confiscated all Király submachine guns which were superior to all guns in Hungary’s arsenal.

Bayonets can also be attached to Király 43M as well which should also get its bayonet.
1128765680_preview_43m danuvia

The Király submachine gun accepts the standard Hungarian 35M mannlicher bayonet.

All guns should get their bayonets as a general rule, but in the case of the Király, the bayonet was actually used in guarding and intimidation.

The recoil

Both 39M and 43M have delayed blowback, this action is really rare for World War II guns because it increases production costs and makes the gun maintenance heavy but it does significantly reduce recoil.
Interestingly this fact is acknowledged by the in-game description of the Király 39M, but most ironically, the Király in-game does not live up to it and has very high recoil for a submachine gun.

Looking at other guns on this BR, a 10% recoil control increase would be more than reasonable.

Király recoil in real life: In real life, Király submachine guns had very low recoil.

The accuracy

The Király submachine gun was praised for its excellent range which was indeed impressive for a submachine gun of its time.
Hungarian sources usually mention more than 300m of effective range.
Of course this is rather unusual since most submachine guns have an effective range of 150-200m and a maximum range of 200-250m, in case of the Király no one speaks of the maximum effective range.
Understanding this “abnormality” takes some firearms knowledge but I will attempt to simplify it down as much as possible.

The range of a gun is first and foremost determined by the ammunition used, the weight and the shape of the projectile. A heavier projectile will fly more stable than a lighter one, thus having less dispersion.
The muzzle velocity is the second most important factor and the 9x25´s velocity is actually insufficient for shooting at ranges longer than 300m. A tangent sight can be used to adjust the gun to compensate for the fall of the projectile however during WW2 soldiers did not have modern range finders and conscripts were not expected to be capable of determining the range in the heat of combat. However theoretically the Király could hit human sized targets up to a kilometer away. Overall most will agree that the 300m claim is the most reasonable for actual combat.

Why not just increase the muzzle velocity? - because that would come at the cost of the projectile´s weight.

A test was carried out in 1940 with an experimental lighter round that had much more muzzle velocity (in colour green) almost as much as the 8mm kurz, however the lighter round lost stability around 200m and dispersion became too much at around 250m thus the heavier original Mauser round (in orange) was kept in service.
Finally, on the bottom a 35M rifle chambered in 8x56R (black) is fired for comparison.

TL;DR: The Király 39M enjoyed the least dispersion out of any WW2 submachine gun, so its in-game stats should at least reflect good dispersion in-game.
Király 39M and 43M should get 62 dispersion instead of the current 82 dispersion (by default).

This might sound like a major buff but in practice, the biggest issue with using the Király at medium range will still remain the low damage over distance and very uncomfortable recoil pattern so actually it will only buff Király to have around the same accuracy as the ZK-383 (BR3).

improvements:

bayonet added
recoil control: increased from 60% to 70%
dispersion/deviation: decreased by 25%

Comparison of current and proposed Király 39M and 43M with other BR4 submachine guns

Submachine Guns			Damage				Reload Timings (s)			Statcard Recoil			Effective Recoil			Moving Spread Increase
Weapon Name	Obtained	BR	10m	100m	Velocity	Magazine	Reload	Alt Reload	Rate of Fire	Vertical	Horizontal	Recoil Control	Vertical	Horizontal	Dispersion	While Aiming	Hipfiring	Visual Recoil	Recoil Dir	ADS Speed	Recoil Offset	Sprint Factor	Weight	Additional Info
current Kiraly 39M	120000 RP	IV	7,9	4,6	445	40	2,0	1,4	870	32	12	0.4	16	6	0,70	0,0	15,0	1,6	0,5	0,8	0,3	100%	4,4	40/120
current Kiraly 43M	Premium	IV	7.9	4.6	445	40	2.2	1.50	840	34	16	0.4	14	6	0.71	0.0	15.0	1.6	0.6	0.8	0.3	100%	4.0	40/120
proposed Kiraly 39M	120000 RP	IV	7,9	4,6	445	40	2,0	1,4	870	32	12	0.3	10	4	0,53	0,0	15,0	1,6	0,5	0,8	0,3	100%	4,4	40/120
proposed Kiraly 43M	Premium	IV	7.9	4.6	445	40	2.2	1.50	840	34	16	0.3	10	5	0.53	0.0	15.0	1.6	0.6	0.8	0.3	100%	4.0	40/120
M21/28 Thompson	118000 RP	IV	8.2	5.5	265	30	1.5	1.5	810	39	10	0.3	12	3	0.58	0.0	15.0	1.2	0.31	0.75	0.3	100%	4.0	30/90
M1928A1 Thompson 50	122000 RP	IV	8.2	5.5	265	50	2.9	2.5	810	23	15	0.4	9	6	0.71	0.0	6.0	1.2	0.4	0.68	0.3	100%	4.0	50/100
PPD-34/38	105000 RP	IV	6.6	3.4	450	73	3.2	2.9	920	20	12	0.4	8	5	0.70	0.0	15.0	1.6	0.4	0.7	0.3	100%	4.9	73/73
PPD-40	120000 RP	IV	6.6	3.3	450	71	2.9	2.4	1040	20	11	0.4	8	4	0.68	0.0	15.0	1.6	0.4	0.72	0.3	100%	4.9	71/71
Type 2 SMG	105000 RP	IV	6.8	3.9	350	50	2.3	2.0	860	9	9	0.4	4	4	0.64	0.0	10.0	1.0	0.4	0.9	-	100%	3.4	50/100

Do you want Király to reflect its historical characteristics?

Yes
No

0 voters

Source:

Thank you for your time and attention!

OggeKing · December 30, 2025, 1:16pm

Really interesting to see that a flatter firing-arc doesn’t inherently mean a more accurate one. Almost like Ballistics is a complicated subject which requires dedicated studies to fully grasp…

Anyway; most reasonable changes, the design intent of the guns were to create something closer to light-automatic rifles - rather than conventional SMGs that we are more used to - and that should definitely be represented in game.

GROOT0404 · December 30, 2025, 1:53pm

I’ll take any reason to see Bayonets on weapons that have them, especially SMGs and ARs

TUSUPOLISI69 · December 30, 2025, 2:08pm

While fixing things to historical accuracy could also fix the Kp31.
Its qurrently quite a disgrace to what it should be.

Valkay · December 30, 2025, 2:10pm

Im sorry, Im not familiar with the Soumi submachine guns enough to understand what the issue is with its historical accuracy. Could you please explain to me?

TUSUPOLISI69 · December 30, 2025, 2:19pm

kp31semi100

Accuracy.

Left is 15 single shots from 100m bench rest.
Right is 50 full auto 100m bench rest.

Each Kp31 came with 2 barrels, and each barrel must hit 10/10 rounds at 100m to bullseye.
Not sure did any other smg or gun have similar barrel system, but each barrel was stamped by where the grouping was on test fires.
As example, if your test group was bit high on right side of center of bullseye, it was stamped as so.
This means the user of said barrel could adjust sights without target shots.

And unlike in the game, the gun really doesnt climb as aggressively, it barely does at all.
This is “Korsu” kp31 in video, which demonstrates quite well how minimal or even non-existant the muzzle climb is even without buttstock aka no shoulder support.

The minimal climb was controlled with thumb from end of the gun kinda like in this picture

ssuhina

Valkay · December 30, 2025, 2:29pm

I see, thank you.
You should write a suggestion on the matter, you have my support.

OggeKing · December 30, 2025, 2:43pm

One could say that the guy was utilizing the board for stability, and putting his whole body into keeping it stable on that platform. In game, that would be more akin to mounting the bun on a window-sil, which is already quite powerful…

I dug up this ca 1 minute long part of a video if Ian from Forgotten Weapons, and that guy from InRangeTV (I think, could be someone else, though), shooting the Kp 31 from both standing and kneeling positions unsupported, which I think demonstrates your point a bit better:

From what I can tell from the video, I’d say that Ian is the less experienced shooter, and has trouble controling the gun to begin with (but does quickly adapt to it, in all fairness), meanwhile InRangeTV is demonstrating surprising proficiency with the weapon from the get-go (he actually starts out almost leaning forward, more prepared for the recoil than Ian was), and that’s all without lying prone or using a bench for support. I can’t really say how this compares to in game, though, as I don’t own the squad and haven’t tried using the weapon yet.

But, to be short, a dispersion and recoil buff might indeed be warranted.