Fall of Hong Kong Campaign Proposal

Suggestions - Archive
1

So, a lot of people have been having a crack at this, so I thought I would have a go it myself. For some of you who recognize me from the Discord, this will be no surprise, but I’m going to propose a battle of Hong Kong campaign.

Hong Kong was a British colony and a major port city for much of the 19th and 20th century, known as the “Gateway to the East”. In the Second World War, The Japanese stormed it on December 8, 1941, a day after Pearl Harbor was attacked. Japanese forces attacked through mainland China from the North, driving the Commonwealth defenders back to Hong Kong Island. There, the defenders held out for two and a half weeks waiting for reinforcements which would never arrive. Finally on Christmas morning, the Governors of Hong Kong had decided to surrender, and the surrender was official the next day.

Reasons for Hong Kong
Hong Kong is one of a few special cases of Urban warfare in the Pacific. This instantly makes it a unique campaign. Furthermore, Hong Kong in the 1940s, while urban, was still quite small in terms of scale when compared to things like Berlin, think the city conquest map in Moscow scale of buildings, but dotted around the territory. Furthermore, the campaign is early war UK versus Japan, making it nigh impossible for either side to get their hands on Semi-Auto or Full-Auto Infantry weapons, as the UK would not attempt to acquire one any time during the course of the war, and the Japanese would only begin development of their own after capturing Garands. As be seen in the popularity of Moscow and Tunisia, this type of gameplay is desirable for the community. Finally, Hong Kong is the perfect place to focus more on Infantry, as the only armor the Commonwealth forces fielded was armored cars, and the Japanese only fielded tankettes.

Campaign Proposals
My proposal for the campaign is as follows:
Allies

  • Starting Gear:
    • Pattern 1914 Enfield
    • Mills bombs
    • Det Pack
    • Molotov Cocktail
  • Handguns:
    • Enfield Mk. 2 No. 1
    • Colt New Service
    • Webley Revolver
    • M1911A1
  • Starting Squads:
    • Royal Rifles of Canada, A Company (Trooper)
      • Ross Rifle Mk III
    • Royal Scots Regiment, A Company (Sniper)
      • Pattern 1914 Enfield with scope
    • Winnipeg Grenadiers, A Company (Assaulters)
      • Sten Gun
  • Level 2
    • Hong Kong Volunteer Defense Corp/Royal Hong Kong Regiment (Tanker)
      • Bedford chassis armored car
        • 1 x Boys AT rifle
        • 1 x Bren LMG
  • Level 3
    • 22nd Fortress Company, Royal Engineers (Engineers)
      • SMLE Mk III
  • Level 4
    • Winchester 1912
  • Level 5
    • 14th Punjab Regiment, A Company (Bombers)
      • Boys AT rifle
  • Level 6
    • Lanchester
  • Level 7
    • 7th Punjab regiment (Radio)
      • No 4 Mk 1 Lee Enfield
  • Level 8
    • Ross Rifle Mk III with scope
  • Level 9
    • Royal Airforce Hong Kong Station (Attacker)
      • Vickers Vildebeest
        • 500 kg bomb
        • 2 x Vickers LMG
  • Level 10
    • Midddlesex Regiment, B Company (Gunner)
      • Vickers Berthier
  • Level 11
    • Royal Air Force Hong Kong Station (Fighter)
      • Gloster Sea Gladiator
        • 4 x Vickers machine guns
  • Level 12
    • Hong Kong Volunteer Defense Corp/Royal Hong Kong Regiment (Motorcycle)
      • BSA M20 with sidecar and Vickers LMG
  • Level 13
    • Winnipeg Grenadiers, B Company (Mortars)
      • SBML two–Inch Mortar
  • Level 14
    • 14th Punjab Regiment, B Company (Sniper II)
      • SMLE Mk III with scope
  • Level 15
    • Royal Scots Regiment, B Company (Trooper II)
      • SMLE Mk III with Grenade launcher
  • Level 16
    • M21/28 Thompson SMG
  • Level 17
    • Fairey Swordfish
      • 2 x 250 kg bombs
      • 1 x Vickers LMG
  • Level 18
    • Bren Mk II Light Machine Gun
  • Level 19
    • Hong Kong Volunteer Defense Corps, B Company (Flametrooper)
      • No II Mk II Flamethrower
  • Level 20
    • Ordnance ML 3–inch Mortar
  • Level 21
    • Vickers 6 ton Type B
      • 1 x 3 pounder cannons
      • 1 x Vickers Machine Gun
  • Level 22
    • Royal Rifles of Canada, B Company (Assaulter II)
      • M21/28 Thompson SMG with 50 round drum
  • Level 23
    • 40th Fortress Company, Royal Engineers (Engineer II)
      • M1 Carbine
  • Level 24
    • M1 Thompson SMG
  • Level 25
    • P-40E-1 Warhawk
      • 2 x 45 kg bombs
      • 6 x 12.7 mm M2 Browning machine gun
  • Level 26
    • Hong Kong Chinese Regiment (Gunner II)
      • Lewis Gun

Axis

  • Starting Gear:
    • Type 30 rifle
    • Type 97 Grenade
    • Det Pack
    • Molotov Cocktail
  • Handguns:
    • Type 26 Revolver
    • Smith & Wesson Model 3
    • 8mm Nambu Pistol
    • Hamada Type 1
  • Starting Squads
    • 230th Infantry Regiment, 3rd Battalion (Trooper)
      • Type 38 rifle
    • 66th Infantry Regiment, (Sniper)
      • Type 30 Sniper Rifle
    • 229th Infantry Regiment, 1st Battalion (Assaulter)
      • Type 100 SMG(1940 version)
  • Level 2
    • 38th Division, Armor Squadron (Tanker)
      • Type 94 Tankette
        • 6.5mm Type 91 machine gun
  • Level 3
    • 38th Engineers Regiment (Engineer)
      • Type 44 Carbine
  • Level 4
    • Vz 24/ Type Mo rifle III
  • Level 5
    • 229th Infantry Regiment, 2nd Battalion (Bombers)
      • PzB 38
  • Level 6
    • MP 34
  • Level 7
    • 38th Division, Signal Corps (Radio)
      • Type 99 Rifle
  • Level 8
    • Type 99 Sniper Rifle
  • Level 9
    • 23rd Army Air Unit, 45th Flying Senate
      • Kawasaki Ki-3
        • 500 kg bomb
        • 2 7.7mm machine guns
  • Level 10
    • 230th Infantry Regiment, 1st Battalion (Gunner)
      • Type 96 Light Machine Gun
  • Level 11
    • 23rd Army Air Unit, 10th Independent Chutai (Fighter)
      • Nakajima Ki-27
        • 2 × 7.7 mm Type 89 machine guns
  • Level 12
    • 228th Regiment, 1st Battalion (Motorcycle)
      • Type 93 motorcycle with sidecar
        • Type 97 Light Machine Gun
  • Level 13
    • 21st Mortar Battalion (Mortar)
      • Type 98 50 mm infantry mortar
  • Level 14
    • 228th Regiment, 3rd Battalion (Sniper II)
      • Type 99 Sniper Rifle
  • Level 15
    • 229th Infantry Regiment, 3rd Battalion (Trooper II)
      • Type 99 Rifle with Type 100 grenade discharger
  • Level 16
    • Nambu type 2 SMG
  • Level 17
    • Kawasaki Ki–32
      • 4 x 100 bombs
      • 1 x 7.7 mm Type 89 machine gun
  • Level 18
    • Type 99 Light Machine gun
  • Level 19
    • 20th Independent Engineer Regiment (Flamethrower)
      • Type 93 Flamethrower
  • Level 20
    • Type 94 90 mm infantry mortar
  • Level 21
    • Type 95 Ha-Go light tank
      • 1 x 37 mm cannon
      • 2 × 7.7 mm Type 97 machine gun
  • Level 22
    • IJN Marines (Assaulter II)
      • Nambu type 2 SMG with 50 round mag
  • Level 23
    • 14th Independent Engineer Regiment (Engineer II)
      • Type 2 TERA rifle
  • Level 24
    • Type 97 Automatic Cannon
  • Level 25
    • A6m2 Zero
      • 2 x 60 kg bombs
      • 2 x 20 mm Type 99 Model 1 cannons
      • 2 x 7.7 mm Type 97 navy machine guns
  • Level 26
    • 38th Division, (Find appropriate Regiment) (Gunner II)
      • Type 92 machine gun

Everything up until level 10 on both sides saw service in the battle with the exception of the the Japanese submachine guns, the PzB 39, and the Kawasaki Ki-3. The Japanese flew the Kawasaki Ki–32 as the primary bomber in Hong Kong, but for parity reasons, I chose the Ki-3. the PzB 39 was chosen as the Japanese had a 20mm semi-automatic anti tank rifle know as the type 97 automatic cannon as their primary anti-tank weapon. For balance reasons, that cannot be the first AT gun on the tech tree, and seeing as the Japanese only ever tested semi-automatic anti-tank guns, a bit of rewriting of history is required for balance sake. The Japanese also rarely fielded submachine guns, believing that light machine guns could fulfill that role. While there is no evidence the Commonwealth forces fielded any Winchester 1912s, police forces fought in the battle and it is highly likely they had some form of a pump action shotgun, hence it’s inclusion. After level 10, it became harder to stick to historical accuracy, as the defenders of Hong Kong were fairly lacking in equipment, and the Japanese also did not divert many resources to the attack, but I stayed as truthful as possible. Whenever it was not possible, I looked to other similar battles like the Battle of Shanghai such as in the case of the Vickers Six Ton vs Type 95 Ha-Go. The Glostar Gladiator and the Fairey Swordfish all never saw action during the battle, but they were included for balance reasons to match some of the Japanese aircraft. Near the end, I found it difficult to stay accurate to history, so I started venturing into a bit of crazy history rewriting. the A6M and the P-40 were included out of a bit of fanboying for both planes on my part, but due to their nature as fighters, the biggest effect they should have is the ability to completely negate all bombers, as both of them completely outclass every proposed bomber here, which most people would say is a good thing. The other egregious non-present vehicles are the aforementioned Vickers Six Ton and Type 95 Ha-Go. However, in this case, I took inspiration form the Battle of Shanghai, where both tanks were present. Balance again, shouldn’t be a problem, as this matchup is roughly equal to the T-26 vs PzIIIb in Moscow, both of which rarely have too large of an influence on there, although that may be due to higher power tanks being present, but even alone on the battlefield, the infantry usually can deal with them quickly.

Map Proposals:
For maps, I chose to focus mostly on Hong Kong Island, as the fighting in Kowloon and the New Territories was sporadic, and mostly so that the Commonwealth could employ scorched earth tactics there and destroy warehouses with equipment.

  • Tai Koo Shipyard
    • A dock at a northern point of the island, where the Japanese launched an invasion of the island.
  • Wong Nei Chong Valley
    • A valley between three mountains with a horse racing track, and connected to Victoria Harbour
  • Tai Hang Village
    • A settlement to the east of Wong Nei Chong Valley, could span the gap between Tai Koo Shipyard and Wong Nei Chong Valley
  • Tai Tam Resovoir
    • A bridge and warehouse by the Tai Tam Resivor
  • Victoria Peak
    • A mountian road up Victoria Peak, the last stand for the majority of the Commonwealth forces
  • Stanley Peninsula Warehouse
    • A warehouse near the southernmost point of Hong Kong Island, cut off from the rest of the Commonwealth forces
  • Intersection conquest map
    • A conquest map similar to the city map in Moscow, but in Hong Kong. (I really like that map, sue me)
12 Likes
2

this would be rare BA exclusive campaign.

1 Like
3

Well, plus at least for the work done.

But do we really need another campaing?

1 Like
4

It would be SMG and LMG spam if only got BA rifles…

5

Need, but fix the major problem first :triumph::triumph:

6

like all campaigns? The problem is Semi-auto rifles.

7

Including New Territories and Kowloon would be nice since we can hv more type of landscape and more elements for the campaign.

8

There are many of them, the main problems.

9

It could be interesting, but as I stated in the original post, most of the combat was done on Hong Kong Island, and most of the combat done there was too sporadic. Besides, Kowloon was mostly ports at the time, and the New Territories lacked much development back then too. Most of the urban areas in 1940 would have been in Hong Kong Island.

10

Thats why not only HK Island, including atleast Kowloon will hv more kind of battle, although it only hold Jp for less than 2 days, but atleast there’s Gin Drinker’s Line around Shing Mun Reservoir, and the underground tunnels there would be fun.

But, have a good dream.:face_with_hand_over_mouth:

11

I’m a little bit adverse to having a large defensive position having played Normandy. I know it makes absolute sense, but balancing would be a nightmare, so I would just prefer to ignore it.

12

I’m gonna have to ask you to provide some evidence that the ross rifle saw combat at all in WW2, saw combat in Hong Kong, and saw combat with the Canadian forces who had removed it from frontline service more than twenty years prior. Don’t get me wrong, by the time you get to the Mk 3 ross, it’s a fine weapon, but by the time you get to WW2 it’s a training rifle at best, and only in service with home guard and coastal patrol units with the Navy.

The rest of this I mostly like, especially the inclusion of the Lewis gun. It may not have seen a lot of use in most theaters of the war, but I’d love to have it anywhere british equipment is available just to have something with a clean sightline. The vickers and bren sights take up entirely too much of the view.

13

They were issued to canadian sailors at the time and were popular as a hunting rifle in the commonwealth colonies, so even if no sailors had one, there was at least a few members of the HKVDC who had one. I met a guy in Hong Kong once who showed me his Ross rifle and he said it belonged to his grandfather, so that was my basis for including it. It may be a bit of a stretch, but the Ross would have been a more preferable inclusion than say the Enfield 1917 in my opinion.

14

That’s fair.

I’m also confused at the amount of American equipment I’m seeing for commonwealth forces, but I don’t have the knowledge to dispute it. The Thompson makes sense, I know those were lend-leased with the drums and all, but the colt new service and 1911? The M1 Carbine? The revolver I can see, the 1911 is confusing, and I have serious doubts that if the UK and Commonwealth nations had M1 carbines in number that they’d have sent them to Hong Kong.

15

A few 1911s were issued to the British forces, namely police again as well as Airmen. Furthermore, Canadian officers were prone to spending their own money to get one for themselves. For the M1c, Its at the point where I was just making stuff up because nothing else existed. I’m not particularly happy with it, especially because it’s wouldn’t even enter service in the US army until 1942, but a lack of any other guns necessitates its inclusion. However, it and the Type 2 TERA are iffy inclusions at best, which are only there because the Engie IIs need a gun.

16

Nice one. Like and bump

17

this would be a cool campaign, and it seems like it would be a bit hard to mess up the balance (tho i kno that fools can be pretty ingenious, so to speak). i would play this for sure

18

It sounds very interesting suggestion! I support it!!
Such battles are not so famous, but they seem to be fun with interesting combinations of armies.

Pointing out from a nasty nerd:

About Handguns

Pistol for Japanese soldiers is 14th Year Type Pistol [十四年式拳銃]. “8 mm Nambu Pistol” sounds too broad category: it includes not only 14th Year Type Pistol but also Army-Type Pistol, original Nambu Large Pistol etc.
Also, Type 94 Pistol [九四式拳銃] is worth for addition. Originally it was pistol for officers but not only them but also tankers, pilots and paratroopers also used it.

To be honesty, 26th Year Type Revolver [二十六年式拳銃, / aka “Type 26”] sounds too old. As name shown, it was adopted in Meiji 26 = Western era 1893! When the war started, most of them were replaced by several Nambu-design pistols. I understand why you want to add lots of them, but I think pistols are better than revolvers for “historical”.

In Japan, officers purchase pistol themselves, but most of them purchased semi-automatic pistols, not revolvers.
Among them, most popular pistol was FN Browning M1910 Pistol and second was Colt M1903 Pocket Hammerless. Less wealthy officers used cheap Spanish-made Astra pistols (Astra M300 etc) and low-quality Japanese-made ones (Sugiura pistol, Inagaki pistol, Hino pistol, Hamada Type 1 pistol etc).

For unique weapon, Mauser C96 (Type “Mo” / Mauser-Type Large Pistol) [モ式大型拳銃] sounds interesting, too. Japanese captured lots of C96 from Chinese army, and adopted it as semi-official weapon of the IJA.

About Rifles

I guess it means 30th Year Type (Type 30) Rifle with sniper scope, but unfortunately it is not exist.

Japanese “adopted” sniper rifles (except for prototypes) are as below:
Type 38 Modified Sniper Rifle — Type 38 Infantry Rifle which is modified as Type 97 sniper rifle.
Type 97 Sniper Rifle — A high-quality type 38 rifle selected from the production line and remodeled as a sniper rifle.
Type 99 Short Sniper Rifle — Sniper rifle based upon Type 99 Short Rifle. Longer variant was not produced much, so it is often called just “Type 99 Sniper Rifle”.
Type 99 Sniper Rifle — Sniper rifle based upon Type 99 Rifle.

Also, I think all Type 99 Rifles should be Type 99 Short Rifle. Among Type 99 series, Type 99 Rifle is rarely produced and most of the production was Type 99 Short Rifle.

In that time, all early-Arisaka rifles like Type 30 infantry rifles and 35th Year Type naval rifle were already retired and used for military training at school. At least, 35th Year Type were used at the late of war by the lack of weapons, but I’ve never heard Type 30 rifle was used by troops during WW2…

Production of Type 2 Rifle (Te-Ra rifle) was started since 1942.
But Battle of Hong Kong was ended in December 25, 1941

About Submachine Guns

Type 100 SMG was adopted in February 1941, not 1940.
In that time, there were only several prototypes that called Experimental Model 3 SMG.

Exp. Model 3 SMG [1939] → Modified Model 3 Ko SMG [1939, build 5] → Modified Model 3 Otsu SMG [1939, build 5] → Type 100 SMG “early” [1942, build about hundreds] / Type 100 SMG Special [1942, for paratrooper] → Type 100 SMG “late” [1944, build approx.9000]

Is the Naval Landing Forces participated the battle? I’ve never heard cruiser Isuzu and others send landing forces to Hongkong.
Anyway, I’m confusing about “Nambu Type 2 SMG”. Is it Nambu SMG Mark 2? or Experimental Model 2 SMG?

As far as I know, prototype SMG with 50 ammo magazine is Nambu-Type SMG Mark 2 [南部式機関短銃二号] and Experimental Model 1 SMG [試製一型機関短銃]. That large magazine was inconvenient and long loading time, so since Model 2 they used 30 ammo magazine.
Difference between Nambu Mk.2 SMG and Mod.1 SMG were ammunition. Nambu Mk.2 had 8x22mm Nambu but Mod.1 SMG had 6.5x30 Type 95.
https://i.imgur.com/ZF9rFTq.png

In my opinion, for historical weapons we can add not only MP34o (S1-100) but also MP18 & MP28. Both are German SMG, but in Japanese service they have different ammunition, magazine and bayonet so it sounds good unique weapon for Japanese.

Why do English documents break the names of Japanese weapons with strange translations? Its hard for Japanese speakers to understand what they means…

About Motor

I guess it is Type 89 Grenade Launcher (typo?)
In Japan, infantry motor were operated by just infantry and motor artillery did not used it. In case of 21st Mortar Battalion (迫撃第二十一大隊), they had 36x Type 94 Light Mortar (strangely English books call it Type 94 Infantry Mortar in spite of it was used by artillery).
I think normal infantry unit is suitable for mortar troops.

I think both mortars are too large. Unlike in-game light mortars, its artillery weapon. They need to be disassembled for transport and require 2-3 troops to carry the mortar. If anything, it’s heavy fire support weapon that radio operator request to fire.

About Aircraft

I understand why you choose them, and I think its logical, too.
However, at least Ki-32 (Type 98 light bomber) had very weak bomb loadouts: 4x 100 kg so its not a serious problem. If it is too fast, we can also choose Ki-36 (Type 98 army cooperation aircraft) from list of aircraft in Battle of Hongkong. It was still faster than Vildebeest, but bomb is limited to 250 kg.

1 Like
19

I don’t know enough about Japanese hand guns, so I’ll take your word on it. For the High power though, I debated between it and the 1911, but I decided on the 1911 because I knew Canadian forces liked to buy them for themselves

For the type 30 rifles, I picked them for starter rifles because starter rifles are usually pre war guns (Like the Springfield, which is a WW1 gun). That is why I chose them for the starter rifle.

Yeah, I said I wasn’t happy about either the TERA or the M1 carbine, both of them being introduced in 1942. I played around with having the SMLE MKIII and Type 38 Carbine with trench mags, but given that trench mag guns are exclusive to alpha players currently, I don’t see them adding either.

I didn’t know they were called the Experimental Model 3 SMG at the time, thanks for that correction. As for the prototype issue, see the game often overlooks stuff like that (see Jumbo in Normandy).

There were Marines on some of the Islands closer to the mainland after the battle for the island began, didn’t see any fighting, but since I’m putting an experimental gun in them, why not put a unit which didn’t fight there.

Yup, Nambu Type 2 refers to the Experimental Model 2 SMG. I know the 50 round magazine was bulky and inconvenient and was never issued, but the game often over looks things like that for the sake of balance (See MkB 42 in Moscow), and it was the best option to counter the drum tommy.

About the Mp-18 and Mp-28, the Mp-34 is an improvement on both systems and the precedent currently is that a campaign either gets the Mp-28 or the Mp-34. Seeing as the Mp-28 suffers from it’s small ammo count, I opted for the Mp-34.

It was difficult to find something to match the current mortars, but a Type 98 50mm mortar did exist, and for the sake of balance I opted to include it. Here is a link to a catalogue page for one in the Australian War Memorial: https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C1127947. For the knee mortar, I had a bit of difficulty finding a British match for that (PIAT maybe?), so I opted to exclude it. For the larger Mortars, I know they were crew served weapons, but I was looking for something to fill gaps, and they seemed like a decent enough potion.

Yeah, the Ki-36 would probably be better for historical accuracy, but this game isn’t too shy about a bit of historical revisionisms for the sake of balance (see Hs 123 in Moscow for an apt comparison).

I have been working on an improved proposal on my own time, and if you would like to see it, let me know. I would be happy to share what I got.

1 Like
20

sounds good