Weapon attachment logistics rework

Suggestions
1

The way weapons with attachments work in the present system, you can have multiple versions of exactly the same gun, but with different attachments.

  • Kar 98K (Normal, with bayonet)
  • " " with Scope
  • " " with Grenade Launcher
  • " " with AT Grenade Launcher

These guns have separate squads to grind to unlock their upgrades, have separate pricetags, are exclusive to their classes and, most notably, are independently upgraded.

If you invested in upgrading, for example, Kar 98ks, grinding the grenade launcher or sniper variants are completely separated, requiring you to unlock and then level up their respective squads separately upgraded.

This separation is a logistical problem due to the time necessary to unlock and then level up these squads, as well as their prohibitive costs. These costs, in my opinion, do not correspond to their actual performance.

I have to stress this as a matter of concern, the purchase prices of upcoming weapons will be significantly increased.

  • 1 silver weapon order is earned at the present for every 25,000 experience accrued.
  • The rewards for battle will not change in any way (Quoted from the news)
  • I weapons will cost 2 silver equivalent in coins. (50,000 experience)
  • II weapons will cost 6 silver equivalent in coins. (150,000 experience)
  • III weapons will cost 10 silver equivalent in coins. (250,000 experience)

This means AT grenade launchers, for reference, would cost over 3 times how they are right now.

Progression tier levels (Rifle grenades hover in tier 2-4, for reference)

Images below quote the news.

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My proposal is simple.

Weapons with attachment slots should remove the restrictions on what can be attached to the weapon itself.

What is unlocked, researched and purchased, instead, are attachments you can put on any existing weapon that can accept the attachment. However, the attachment will impose a class restriction.

For example, if you purchase an M1 Garand and upgrade it to +2, with the correct attachment, you can turn it into either a rifleman-only grenade launcher or sniper-only rifle, with both versions also being +2. However, before I can put a sniper scope on the M1 Garand, I have to first unlock the sniper variant in the (future) tech tree.

Instead of, say, owning 20 garands, with 10 regular variants, 5 GL variants and 5 sniper variants, I can merely own only 10 garands and just have 10 specialist attachments.

I would no longer need to separately upgrade the GL and sniper variants, I would merely need to put on the correct attachment.

Why would I make this a point?

Because the costs of buying weapons are already prohibitive by default, delving into the specialist versions with unique attachments compete with whatever silver/coin budget you set aside to arming your other soldiers.

If we’re using bolt-action rifles with grenade launcher attachments for a reference, you would be paying extra for a rifle you already own, but with an additional functionality in the form of rifle grenades that only you, the player can use, and will no longer have the ability to use if the bot expires before you have a chance to use it. Whereas you can instead choose to use automatic rifles both you and the bot can utilize, without being forced to use an inferior gun.

When the choice is what is essentially a starter rifle with additional functionality exclusive to the player, and an automatic rifle both you can use, it’s an easy economic choice.

Once again, the purchase prices of upcoming weapons will be significantly increased.

Weapons with special attachments should not be a luxury, but a regular part of a player’s toolkit. You should be upgrading less stuff overall, and just paying for additional functionality on top of, and not separately of that.

10 Likes
2

1 gigatrillion more enlisted gold for Gaijin goober

2 Likes
3

Tbh it could be made even simplier.
2+ stars unlock an attachment slot and you can place there whatever you want with no restrictions.

4

Grenade launcher + Sniper scope when

I’m keeping the funni single-slot restriction for simplicity’s sake.

The single attachment slot will dictate what class it will be restricted to and, if necessary, modify the gun’s values as necessary to match their role- ie the sniper scope altering dispersion.

5

I mean that it will still have one slot but from what I understand you want to do something like this:
When I put scope on the gun, it’s pernamently a sniper rifle from now on and I can’t change it to grenade launcher.

And imo it shouldn’t be the case.

Maybe I missunderstand something.

1 Like
6

I’m all for letting any rifle get a grenade launcher or bayonet, but from my understanding most rifles of the time had to be permanently modified to add hardware required for scopes. They didn’t have the luxury of picatinny rails to pop on whatever attachments you like.

Sniper rifles in-game are also more accurate and have less damage drop off than standard rifles. That can be explained currently but saying they pick the best rifles for the job, but it wouldn’t make a ton of sense for them to suddenly change those stats just because there’s a scope on it.

2 Likes
7

Bayonets already very slightly reduce the recoil of guns. 0.95 multiplier.
There’s no reason why attachments wouldn’t be able to modify the accuracy of guns, especially when a sniper scope effectively only affects dispersion for bullet spread.

No. What I mean is, you can attach and remove attachments at will, which changes what class it’s usable by, without changing the upgrade level of the weapon.

From a strict coding perspective, we could just have them swap out the model used when the game loads based on what attachment is currently on the weapon. It’s not like attachments could be swapped on and off during an ongoing match.

If there is a unique model for sniper variants, especially in the absence of modern attachment rails, then it could simply be what ends up being used.

1 Like
8

Yeah, but you keep forgetting other kind of orders will accumulate to new currency as well.
It’s not only about silver order weapon orders.
You are acting like after implementation of currency system we will end up grinding only value of silver orders. Which is not true.
You can use value of silver soldier order and bronze orders to buy your weapons.

Your “math” is completely wrong and not reflecting reality. The main difference is we will no longer be forced to use specific resources for specific things.
That’s why I have more several hundreds of III and IV soldiers currently while definitely not having that many weapons to be able to equip them all. Silver soldier orders has basically no value for me. Literally non.
Of course it has to more expensive, but it’s definitely not that dramatic as you presented it.

9

The point that I am making when I bring up the new economy is to illustrate how heavy of an investment it is to purchase what are essentially identical weapons with different attachments.

I would be more than happy to know exactly how many coins you would get per experience point you earn in a match, but these numbers are not provided, so I used the closest available equivalent for convenience.

The point of the thread being: “Why would I need to buy the same gun again, and separately grind the upgrades for it simply because it has a different attachment?” Logistically speaking, it competes with the resources you have, so I put an emphasis on the costs involved.

10

I just had problem that you were using new currency system only as means to support your suggestions. Especially since you were depicting new currency system as something a lot more pricier than current one.

5 different version of the same weapon are completely unrelated to any currency.
But I think we are already too deep in the game to change this concept.
For example event and premium squads, some of them like FG-42 with GL or AS-44 are just another variant or version of the progression weapon. How would you solve this problem? Keep tons of exceptions anyway?
Plus if i remember correctly, sniper version of weapons do have very often different stats. They aren’t truly the same thing.
And last, after merge you will be able to choose which version you prefer. You don’t have to brainlessly get all of them (but you still can, so there will always be something to grind out).

11

The difference lies almost solely in their dispersion stat.

Except the MkB 42H, which, for whatever reason gets an RoF boost.

They are tangentially related because it ultimately means their costs are separate.

Those would remain unique, the suggestion merely intends to target what can be unlocked through progression. As event unlocks/premiums, they would fall under that except unless for whatever reason they had the sensibility to no longer make them exclusive to their squads.

So far, only premium weapons have turned into tech tree unlocks, but event weapons have remained exclusive.

12

Some also have less damage drop over distance, also they’re usually different models of rifles; with more differences than just the same gun with a scope bolted on. Some don’t have the hardware required for bayonet or grenade launcher attachments

1 Like
13

Again, modifications to stats thru attachments is already something implemented. Equipping bayonets, for example, has a recoil multiplier of 0.95. Adjusting their dispersion and their damage won’t be an issue.

Already addressed.

14

Except that doesn’t make any sense. Are you suggesting just paying to swap out weapons for other weapons instead of buying multiples? If a modification requires an entirely different gun then it’s not really a modification anymore

1 Like
15

You pay to have an attachment. Said attachment gets stored the same way unequipped attachments do.

Equipping an attachment would just equip it. You can equip/remove them at will at no cost.

The key point is making the weapon upgrade state independent of the attachment itself, which would reduce the cost overall.

I don’t understand. Do you want to argue in terms of how it works in real life, where different variants of weapons are literally hand-modified for the task, or strictly in-game terms for logistics simplification?

Because I’m strictly sticking with the latter.

16

Yes, I’m against the cod style anything goes modifications. If it’s going to be done it should be something that’s possible to do with the weapon. I’m all for bayonets and grenades, and possibly magazines as well. I’m against hot swappable optics and other gamey nonsense

17

So you’re saying that you are against what is essentially a quality of life improvement to make weapon upgrading simpler and easier, simply because you feel the need to implement some extra features of realism in a game that has long abandoned the concept?

You want to add to the grind- For realism?

Look, I ain’t suggesting frankenguns with red dot sights and suppressors. I’m merely using the existing attachment system to make logistics simpler.

If they had never intended the attachment slot to do anything useful, they would have never ported the feature from CRSED, Enlisted’s predecessor battle royale, and simply kept the guns as separate guns, with no option to add or remove attachments at will.

18

Since the system already has separate weapons for snipers, there’s nothing being added to the grind. I agree this game isn’t completely accurate to reality, and I don’t want the system dumbed down further just because you don’t want another icon on your inventory page.

How many sniper rifles are even required for a given army? Unless you’re bringing along every sniper squad to each battle you don’t need more than a handful of rifles for them. Snipers don’t even use the same class of weapons as anyone else, so it’s not like the interchangeable weapon attachments will even be useable for them.

1 Like
19

Except it’s not a matter of adding to grind, but a matter of reducing the grind.

If you tell an obese person to cut down on eating unhealthily, it would result in them being relatively healthier, but they’re still going to remain obese until drastic changes are applied.

Rifle grenade launchers exist.

Name me an unlockable sniper weapon with no direct unlockable counterpart.

Off the top of my head, there are none, though the G98 is worth mentioning because it has a gold order counterpart. The rest are unlockable through normal progression.

20

Huh? Which one?