everyone learns by suiciding first few times. didnt even know that rearm point exists when i took plane first time (think that there needs to be better info ingame regarding game mechanics). also there is penalty if you straight suicide… you need to wait some 20+ seconds before respawning again.
well not really as f2p player if you have selected tank squad, which is probably what majority has.
perhaps make them vulnerable to small arms fire like they were in past.
Depends quite alot on whos flying. Average joe probably does more harm to hes own team with hes piloting skills and then theres those few that can make a rather significant differency to outcome with plane.
But comparing tank to plane works about as long as you compare which can sponge more hits and in that sense they are equal.
But tanks can be destroyed by every class / every infantry soldier while planes require pretty much a fighter pilot to effectively taken down and even with fighter those planes can sponge a about quadrublletrilliontenhundred hits and still be functional.
From ground perspective the only “effective” way is AA so you need engineer squad aka dedicated squad to fight against the planes. And even then the effectivenes of AA is rather questionable.
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You’re absolutely right, that’s exactly what I mean.
There should be more threats to the plane so that you don’t have to have a special unit.
That said, it should fly longer from respawn, otherwise it clears the point too quickly, which makes it the most effective at short range.
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I find planes only annoying in France but then its the same campaign with Jumbos and Panthers so I guess I can live with that.
IL in Moscow is spongy but I would say its a bigger pain in the ass for the Luftwaffe than for ground plebs.
There is no excuse for a tank to be destroyed in 6 different ways, with 1 of them in every soldier’s possession.
The airplane in turn is an instant kamikaze attack that cannot be stopped, and by itself it has no particular threat
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Planes are the biggest issue mainly for Normandy. Allies especially, just spam rockets and 500lbs bombs , since they’re comically unbalanced, meanwhile Axis ones are just flying cardboard box. Also have fun trying to shoot them down, AAA guns literally do nothing to them.
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That’s where I play most of the time. I don’t know how to narrow it down to Normandy (allowing only Normandy engineers to build a light anti-aircraft gun is weird)
But at least the flight time of the aircraft from the respawn should be increased and a warning to do. And do adequate damage 20mm cannons. I spend 400-500 shells to shoot down a plane, although in WT enough one volley.
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uhhhhh, i would say that the axis aircraft are a pain in the ass especially the bf110 which is the most broken thing for an early unlock
German missiles have no centers and fly inaccurately(I mean, they fly parallel and you have to aim one, unlike the U.S. missiles), so they are more difficult to hit than U.S. missiles.
In addition, there are fewer of them, but they also require a direct hit.
I’m already tired to go out on the tank and in 30 seconds to catch missiles from any nub that took a p38 and flew into me
the bf110 has subpar AT abilities in exchange for extremely deadly AA abilities, however both are extremely good at raping infantry which is more important imo since infantry can cap points.
You know,
There used to be (and sometimes ther still is) a proliferation of threads similar to this one,
Except they were/are threads from angry infantrymen tired of being pounded by untouchable tanks in the gray zone, impervious to frontal attacks.
“Tanks are too powerful! Why should a single tanker be allowed to farm easy kills, without a way for the enemy to fight back?”
“AT weapons are too weak, and even if we bring engineer squad to build AT guns, they’re not powerful enough!”
Those came mainly from Normandy players, pissed off either against Jumbo or Panther.
(Whose best counter is, guess what? Planes.)
By your reasoning, should Devs “balance” tanks by making them spawn 2 km further so that they waste whole minutes driving through empty countryside before reaching action?
Or force you into a 2 min lock every time you die in a tank?
Revenge bombing is a thing, but so are revenge tanking and revenge TNTing. Unless you camp from grey zone with Jumbo/Panther/Tiger, of course.
To make things clear:
I am not a plane main. I’m just pointing at your attempt to make pilots lives miserable, so you can become top dog again in your tank and farm kills undisturbed.
As much as planes DM is currently bullshit, your requests appear to eventually boil down to dear ol’ “X kills me, X OP, nerf X asap!”
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I too believe there is a general lack of available counter measures agiainst planes.
Especially with Enlisted’s F2P limit of 1 vehicle spot per player, and the necessity to unlock and upgrade an Engineer squad in order to even be able to build an AA gun, new players literally have zero counters to planes.
Having played Battlefield series for a couple decades, here is what it would usually have:
- pre-placed stationary AA guns around the map which could be used by any soldier (may have to be ‘built/fixed’ first;
- ability to spawn in an AA vehicle and try to take down the plane;
- ability to spawn in a fighter plane and try to take down the plane;
- hand-held AA weapons (like Fliegerfaust in BFV).
And while something like the Fliegerfaust would be too ahistorical for my liking, one could imagine why the devs of BFV introduced it after a year of the game’s release - nobody likes to be farmed by planes without a chance to shoot back.
I believe Enlisted could at least benefit from pre-placed stationary AA guns so that not only the engineers squad would have AA cababilities.
Additionally, it would be great (but seems improbable) if the vehicle spawn system was reworked to allow for several pre-selected vehicle types which could be spawned ingame depending on the situation (e.g. tank, tank destroyer, AA vehicle, fighter plane, attack plane, bomber).
This is also linked to another issue I’ve been thinking about of how many vehicles are simply left to be obsolete and never be touched because they are too situational (why would you ever pre-select a tank destroyer as your vehicle if the map might be conquest Reich Chancellory? however, you could potentially use it to its strenghts on Seelow Heights).
See this thread for concept: Let players select from available vehicles during a match
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Greyzone tanks has been and still is issue.
But I dont exactly understand your logic here, how broken planes combined with greyzone campping is supposed to negate each other and make things balanced ?
Ah, in that case better keep both broken.
If you say that planes are currently “low risk, high reward”, you have a point.
Making them “high risk, high reward” (more vulnerable to damage, more AA options) is fine for me.
Making them “boring as fuck, low reward” (by adding arbitrary time locks / time sinks), to a point that their earnings per minute become irrelevant, is not.
Generally I wouldnt really throw them in high reward, it requires some knowledge of maps / planes to get those bombs to target. While fair share if not majority magically cant even hit on same server with them.
Well the reward is exactly same as currently, only the time to rearm is longer / the fly to combat area.
Well I consider that as better option than nerfing them to entirely useless.
As something has to be done preferably during this century.
Even the increased cooldown / time to rearm is only bandage in issue of planes being flying tanks, its still better option than waiting them to “fix” the models.
Just look how well theyr doing with theyr bipods.
I think you made some very good points here in pointing out the problems as well as offering solutions.
The most annoying part to me is the abuse of planes as guided Kamikaze rockets which is equally unrealistic as it is cheap since it takes no skill to kill a tank this way. It appears to me as if it needs either additional reward to try to stay alive or punishment like a loss of points when you die or a longer time to respawn. My preferred solution would be a 5 Minute Timer that you need to stay alive in your plane and for every minute you die earlier before these 5 minutes are reaches you have to wait 10 seconds longer to respawn with your next squad- so the maximum is a whole minute to wait until your next spawn when you just crash instantly into the ground.
Additional flying planes is unfortunately simply kinda boring in Enlisted. You fly to the target zone, quickly drop bombs and fly for a looong time back to refill ammo and then for a loooong time to the target zone for a quick drop. Then you just rinse and repeat and eventually get in a dogfight that can be challenging but often take too long to be of any use to anyone. So when attacked - instead of starting a dogfight - your better off to just suicide and respawn.
So it really is time to at least overhaul the damage model - more to War Thunder RB standards of quick kills which most would also expect here that come from WT. Not only would it make air battles more fun and rewarding but also I think it could make people more enthusiastic as a challenge to stay in the air.
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Yes, you say right. I think the ability to build a large caliber machine gun turret for any engineer in different squads would already allow you to fend off really cheeky planes, and the increased distance from the revival point to the battlefield would give you time to build.
yesterday i had a battle where 2 tanks just sat in the hills in gray zone and just sprayed shells over defenders. out of that 6 ways to destroy them, there were suddenly only 2 effective ways to counter them… tanks and planes. and out of that 2 ways to destroy them, our tanks had to go into zone of engagement where enemy soldiers can flank them cause they didnt have clear line of sight of enemy tanks. so tell me how is that fair…
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There are always explosive packets and grenade launchers. 95% of the time you can get to the tank in the gray area.
Also, my suggestions do not change the fact that you can still kill tanks everywhere from a plane.
You won’t be able to do it in 15 seconds, because the airborne time will be longer, which is fair enough.
really explosive packets and GL? with all those enemies spawning between tanks and objective? you would be lucky to get 1/20 soldiers near tank without getting killed either by tank or by enemy soldiers specially in gray zone.
also your suggestions just make planes more tedious to play, while keeping tanks more fun vehicle. 40-45 seconds till you get to objective? you already have long rearm time that makes plane out of action for a minute and then when they bomb they have to rely on either teammates marking the position of enemies, or game knowledge and luck to hit enemies.
same thing with number of squads to rotate.
and tilted “mini AA gun” would not be historically accurate. if you can find something in ww2 that had limited tilt angle i wouldnt mind if they added it, otherwise it would be just another machinegun nest available to every engineer.
best counter would be to increase number of vehicle squads so you can have more people with fighter planes. people hardly choose fighter planes with 1 vehicle slot as f2p and 2 vehicle slots as premium.