Suggesting primary weapons for Germany

First of all I want to encourge you to suggest weapons that are not mentioned here and reply with some informations about them and sources. I want to make pool then where I will give option if there is interest for the firearm to be added to the game and how to acquire them (twitch drops, events etc…).

During WW2 Germany adopted many firearms due to having three different military branches that adopted equipment independently (Wermacht, Luftwaffe and Waffen --). Also german military adopted lot of captured equipment. Because of that german (3rd reich) industry suffered from making all kinds of nonstardnised equipment. This is more evident in army branch of Waffen – that adopted all kinds of firearms.

Because of nonstardnised equipment and industry some firearms instead of being produced in tens of thousands were produced in thousands sometimes not even that and produced just in hundreds.

Pz. B. M. SS 41 or ZB vz. 41

Development of anti-tank rifles in Zbrojovka Brno ( Waffenwerke Brünn) peaked during occupation years by serial production of ZB vz. 41 in caliber 15 x 104 mm (cartridge 15mm BESA) and 7,92 x 94 (german cartridge Patrone 318). Modification of original construction to cartridge 318 factory made in January of 1941, when the factory acquired ammo from german company Bergmann. Development of the gun wasn’t smooth. During the shooting trials after over 600 rounds had been shot there were problems with breakthroughs/cracks. (Also bullets due to lost of stability hit the target with side not the tip). Huge percentage of cracks were eliminated by changing the material of the barrel, that decreased wear of the rifling when shooting.

In February 1941 first 200-piece order was being made with delivery date July 1941. The biggest and only order for 2000 rifles was given to factory by Waffen SS that adopted the rifle under name Panzerbüchse Modell SS 41.

source: VHU PRAHA
(It’s from czech VHU and I did the translation for this post and I did the translation because there isn’t any detailed article about development in english. I’m sorry for any grammar mistakes)

Maschinen Karabiner 42 or MKb 42

First versions of legendery Stg 44 that were tested in 1942. There were two designers Walter and Haenel. Walters design was more accurate during trials but had more malfunctions. Haenels design was chosen because of higher reliability. Overall 200 pieces of MKb 42 (W) (W for Walter) and 8000 pieces of MKb 42 (H) (H for Haenel) were made.

Development:

Development of cartrige with medium balistic performance german companies started in early 30s and result of long experiments was cartrige 7,92 mm Polte (7,92 x 33 mm). Polte company finished it’s development in the end of 1939. As part of development prototypes of automatic rifles were made, developted by Heinrich Vollmer and by company Carl Walther. In May of 1938 the main armaments office set more precise criteria on development of amplified submachingun (verstärkte Maschinenpistole) and gave the development to company C. G. Haenel in Suhl. At that time Haenel emloyed designer Hugo Schmeisser later known as the father of first german assault rifles MKb 42 (H) a MP 43.

Based on demanded requirements (length of the barrel 400 mm, fire selector A / S-A, RoF up to 500 rpm, weight up to 4kg, effective range up to 800m) company Haenel developted prototype for cartrige 7,92 x 33 made by company Polte. New weapon got designation MP 42S later was redesignated sMP 42 (schweres Maschinenpistole 42).

In the spring of 1942 company Carl Walther submitted their prototype for trials. Weapon designed by Hugo Schmeisser had locking of the bolt solved by folding bracket and fired from open bolt like all the other submachineguns. Weapon made by Walther company had the bolt-locked breech and hammer beating mechanism. Advantage of this solution was movement of small mass before shot, because of this there was presumption for higher accuracy. Peculiarity of construction also represented gas intake from the barrel onto movable piston which was loosely strung on the barrel. Steel foregrip is gas tube and impulse from gas moved piston onto stamped bolt carrier.

By the end of March when infantry weapons test department (Wa Prüf 2) tested in Kummersdorf firing range first prototype from Walther. Döberitz infantry school got for firing tests first 50 assault rifles from Haenel. During trials Walthers prototype was more accurate while firing up to 600 meters. Walthers model got recommendation for further development and after that got oder for 200 rifles for comparative tests. For distinguishing the two models armaments office gave to rifles made by Haenel designation Maschinen Karabiner MKb 42 (H) and for Walthers rifles MKb 42 (W). By the end of November 1942 comparative tests took place in Döberitz that confirmed that MKb 42 (W) was more accurate, but it also showed it has more malfunctions if it’s get dirty. Gas system wasn’t satisfactory as well after it shot 50-100 rounds the piston started to jam. The results of test were clear and armaments office choosed rifle model designed by Haenel.

Maschinen Karabiner 42 (Haenel)

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After it was adopted by german armaments office the rifles were then sent to eastern front for further field testing
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/transferable-mkb-42h-assault-rifle-at-ria/

Maschinen Karabiner 42 (Walter)

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Faiths of those 200 rifle that were made by Walther are unclear. One thing is certain small portion of rifles stayed in factory until it was captured by the 11th armored division of the 3rd US army in 3rd of April 1945 as evidenced by surviving photographs. In museums and private collections are at least 21 surviving rifles.

Erma Maschinenpistole 35 or EMP 35


Experts highlight today three basic versions of EMP submachine guns. The first is with an 30 cm barrel, a bayonet attachment unit and a tangential type sight. These submachine guns were delivered by Germany to the countries of Central and Eastern Europe, in particular to Yugoslavia and Bulgaria. The second model was the most massive and was considered standard. The barrel length was 25 cm, the bayonet mount was absent, on some models a simplified L-shaped sight was mounted, on others a tangential type sight. Most often, these submachine guns were equipped with a fuse. The third variant of the EMP was distinguished by the presence of a butt-like MP-18.1 submachine gun.Around 10000 were made.

It is worth noting that the guns of the company “Erma” had a commercial success in the market. Of course, it was difficult to call it significant, but it was not worth it to underestimate. A total of at least 10 thousand EMP submachine guns were produced in Germany, but the exact volume of their release has not been established yet. A batch of these submachine guns in 1936 was purchased by the SS, who used these weapons throughout World War II.

Erma Maschinenpistole 36 or EMP 36

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EMP 36 was predecessor to MP 38.

Mas 38 or MP722(f)


The German army seized the MAS plant in 1940 just as the MAS-38 was entering large-scale production. The Germans accepted the gun as a substitute standard weapon, naming it the 7.65 mm MP722(f). They continued production of the gun for their own armed forces and supplied some to the Vichy French.

Machinengewehr 15 or MG 15


Lack of machineguns caused german infantry to improvise. They field modified MG 15 (aircraft/anti-air mg) to be more useable by infantry.

Machinengewehr 30 or MG 30


The design was rejected by the German Reichswehr which adopted the MG 13. Rheinmetall then turned to other companies and licensed the design to Solothurn in Switzerland and Steyr-Daimler-Puch in Austria. Production soon followed, entering the armed forces of both countries as the Solothurn S2-200 and Maschinengewehr Solothurn 1930, or MG 30, respectively. 2000–3000 were also purchased by Hungary, where it was known as the Solothurn 31.M Golyószóró. After Anshluss of Austria german military had austrian military stock that included MG 30.

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Now these I love
EMP35 is already in the game files and has been available before, tho.

Oh I didn’t know. When it was available? I play since end of december.

berlin open test about a full year ago.

Oh I remember. OAT I played it but I didn’t get to it : /

I like the idea of other german AT rifles.

PzB-38 still somehow works better than the PTRD but when those rifles get fixed, Germany will have to get a semiautomatic AT rifle but I would introduce both PTRS and PzB SS 41 as some collectibles because they were very rare

For other guns, I would like to see some more MP’s like MP-18, MP-34 (but for Moscow), MP-35, Erma…

Gun that I don’t want to see is the Finnish Suomi.
If this gun gets introduced, it will ruin the asymmetry and totally destroy the gameplay because it’s basically a better PPSh for axis

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The Suomi SMG is a non-negotiable must-have. Equipped with the drum magazine, of course.

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First of all, hats off for your work.

To be honest I’m a bit afraid of quantity of SMGs, my main concern is that you have to balance them somehow. The more weapons of the same type you have, the less you can do to make them unique. Like for example one SMG has 400 rof and other 420, a bit too close to make the difference.
Except for that, there is no reason to not implement them one day.

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Just stop why is it that you german players always need protopoop and weapons that barley saw use in ww2

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Why would you make any of these experimental or limited production weapons “primary”??? :roll_eyes:

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A lot of these were made in larger quantities than the MP34(ö), or MP43, which are both most likely going to be in the OBT version of Normandy.

Most of German stuff was made in limited quantity.

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Making further wrongs… bit of a rabbit hole that I think :confused:

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Mate you freeabu’s need to stop asuming I am solely a german main
In that logic, we should just remove the M2 Hyde too as it wasn’t widely used.

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Then stop crying about germany having no weapons they have enough

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So we never going to add any more weapons to any nation anymore?

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Yes
Sticks and rocks
And you have to share the rock

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:clown_face:

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More rocks produced than Germany has won wars recently)))

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Too late, we already have a whole bunch of prototype weapons.
Let us enjoy the more unique weapons.

Provided they’re not balanced horribly like another Gaijin game I’m more than happy for EVERYONE to get protoshit
:muscle:
Provided it isn’t paid only