Giant Battle…..on current hardware

Suggestions
8

yes.
servers nowadays dont represent one physical computer, but they are actually many virtualized servers on one physical computer. so with one epyc 96 core server with 768GB of ram you can make 96 virtualized computers with 1 core and 8GB of ram or 48 virtualized servers with 2 cores and 16GB of ram or 1 server with 96 cores and 768GB ram.

game servers depending on their programming might support multithreading, but more often than not they will be heavily depended on one thread that is main logic. so what does that mean when you want to have lots of players? it means that you can easily host 96 servers with 10v10, but it will be almost impossible to host 1 server with 960v960.

now idk how much compute intensive are their game servers, so it could easily host 10 game servers on virtual server with 1 core, or it could demand 2-4 cores for 1 game server. any increase in number of players is actually capped by ability to compute for main game server thread.

2 Likes
9

the game cannot handle more than 200+ AI / soldiers.

i know that, because i personally tested multiple times through my own PVEs.

above all, consoles are not powerful enough to have more than total numbers of soldiers available.

the game was designed with 10x10 and stress tested with worst possible case scenario, such as having 10 players with squads of 9 soldiers each.
and 90 + 90 = 180 soldiers

even in the zombie mode, the largest wave:

      zombie_rush_zombie:i=8
      zombie_rush_metal_bucket:i=12
      zombie_rush_cart_wheel:i=10
      zombie_rush_bmw_wheel_fast:i=16
      zombie_rush_moto_fast:i=14
      zombie_rush_shield:i=18
      zombie_rush_shield_fun:i=6
      zombie_rush_train_door_fast:i=28
      zombie_rush_spitfire_prop:i=38
      zombie_rush_zombie_phosphor_very_fast:i=7
      zombie_rush_zombie_explosive_very_fast:i=7
      zombie_rush_bomb_fast:i=4
      zombie_rush_bomb_down_fast:i=4
      zombie_ppd_armored:i=3
      zombie_stg_44_armored:i=8
      zombie_rush_paratrooper_spawner:i=6
      zombie_flammenwerfer_armored:i=4
      zombie_sturmpistole_armored:i=2
      zombie_panzerfaust_armored:i=4

only reaches 199 soldiers.
( but even there, they don’t all spawn at once )

the game is not even able to handle more than.
because when you start adding more than 200 soldiers, the game will start lagging, and for those who joins later, will not even fully load the map, other soldiers and what not.

so, i guess it is about servers.
and, not a great optimization on the soldiers.

because having lots of soldiers in a place is very consuming as each has lots of data that it has to calculate and what not.

even funnier now because we do have hit regs problems with current numbers.
let alone having more players to it.

true. closest thing would be BA of Tommy.

well, he did the " impossible " by optimizing alot of code and for example, make vehicle disappear once destroyed.

2 Likes
10

no greyzone, 50 vs 50 people, this would be a great event

@MajorMcDonalds cough, maybe pass along the idea if you think it sounds cool

2 Likes
11

Sure an event sounds fine, but the dream is an actual mode, or perhaps becoming the new standard

We have these big maps that go to waste

2 Likes
12

Is PC more capable. Is the next gen consoles like Series X? Or is it simply hard baked no matter what

How many players/ vehicles was he able to accomplish

I would say that the devs certainly could learn a thing or two if they were to make a giant battle

2 Likes
13

you need to have a good rig.

i tried on a 2060gtx 32gb of ram, and it runned much better.

but when i tried on a medium pc ( 1060ti 16gb of ram ), with 240+ npcs on screen, frames dropped significantly to only 30.

i’d imagine on console could be slighlty better, but again, 50v50 would be impossible.

i believe he made a 25v25

max of 5 vehicles per team of each category.

stable on consoles too though ( if not mistaken )

the difference between my pves though, pre placed soldiers through the editor may not be fully optimized. hence why he was able to have a more stable mission.

there’s more to it. but i don’t know all the details. ( i mean, it’s his mod of course. i can only guess and say / speak only on what he leaked and showed on his various BA notes )

14

I will say that his Big Action certainly is impressive but personally I think it can be a little bit too much to chew and convoluted with his own mechanic additions. Of coarse that’s not a bad thing, everyone has their personal tastes and ideas.

I just think a simple giant battle is more ideal. Make the whole map open, add in a few more players and vehicles to compensate for the larger size, and basically the same vanilla game

3 Likes
15

Bigger battles would be awesome. Certainly the game could handle a 20v20 or 30v30 without issues. Limiting larger battles to next gen/ PC only may need to happen though.

2 Likes
16

Im not against this idea.

My main concerns are

  1. As you raised, can DF and player system’s handle that?

  2. Matches go for too long in my opinion. 25 minutes MAX should be the limit (remember you can always join another battle if you wish to play for longer).

We can debate how long matches should go for elsewhere but yeah Im concerned how many objectives such a BIG map would have and how long it would take.

Perhaps players have the ability to choose Big Map gameplay, like how War Thunder has World War and choices between Arcade and Realistic battles.

Forcing players to fight on a BIG map with a match likely to last like an 1 hour and a half would be inherently unreasonable and I reckon turn people off the game. Like imagine if its a team full of bots or existing BR uptier problems. In short, a crappy battle where youre stuck for over an hour on a map with seemingly never ending objectives.

However I do think current maps could be better used. For example while spectating Ive seen just how large some of the Pacific island maps are and how little of them is used.

Like the Alligator creek map has big mountains and jungles that would be perfect for a Kokoda Track battle on the Owen Stanley range in New Guinea.

They could literally use the same map as Alligator creek (Solomon Islands) but have the battle take place in a different part of the island, call it New Guinea and players wouldnt know the difference.

On the other hand I think cases like Stalingrad are already covered through various smaller maps Fighting across Tractor Plant alone is reasonably large, and then you want to add in Gogol Street and so forth as well?? I think that would be too big.

But for maps that can be used for multiple locations I would suggest

Rome Italy 1944

Vienna Austria 1945

Paris France 1940 and 1944. (with different models for early and late war like different tank hulks and more damaged buildings for late war-higher BR battles)

Crete: A mountainous region, vineyard, small village, large port and German HQ/base.

17

I think you are overestimating how grand such a giant battle would be. I doubt matches would even reach an hour. It would basically be like Conquest now but you’re playing over the whole map, and that increased space and fluidity would bring positive changes to gameplay

And to make it clear I don’t mean the whole map as in various maps are connected to each other from the eye in the sky and you’re fighting for miles, for example Airfield and Omer or the Monastery and Lake Beloe. I mean in that each individual map the whole area is open for battle instead of individual points. The entire map of Airfield from the hangars all the way to the Balloon Hangar, or the entire Gavutu.

1 Like
18

1060ti is is low end PC :stuck_out_tongue: that is 8 year old mainstream GPU.

also depending on the game, limiting factor for large scale battles may not be GPU, but CPU. remember playing really big battles on planetside 2(100+vs100+vs100+) and being CPU bound. GPU doesnt need to draw things that it doesnt see, but CPU needs to calculate things it doesnt see.

19

50 vs 50 is the pipe dream……

But I will say that a skilled modder could certainly create a giant vanilla battle to the best of their ability to see how it goes. Apparently Big Action was able to accomplish 20 vs 20

Both teams only have a spawn on opposite ends of the map, basically no gray zone, multiple objectives, boom.

Obviously every map could and would work for a Giant Battle, the devs literally made each map large but for gameplay restrict it to small sections, but if it was me I’d take a straight forward map like say Airfield to make an example

1 Like
20

Haha i had to pull my.10 year old out for a month after lightning strike. 980ti.

…quite happy to be back.on the 4080 super

21

lightning strikes are the worst… had one encounter myself, but it only fried router and onboard network on my MBO(although MBO died few years later), so i was pretty lucky with damage. one friend had some 5-10k$ damage from one lightning strike some 25 years ago… fried almost all electronics in his house…

btw hope it didnt happen recently cause 50 series should come out in few months.

1 Like
22

Start of the year…10k worth electronics

Still did me a favour…turned a 2080ti and a 3080ti into 2x 4080 supers plus the rest (2 whole pcs)

23

ouch…

idk how is that a favor… unless you had some kind of insurance. you can always repurpose old PC-s into home server or NAS, so it is kind of a waste…

24

Insurance. Ended up with 2 brand new current machines for $750 and they left disposal of machines to me…so i salvaged a third (but since its been juiced its likely to fail at some point)

25

well insurance is nice, but it never makes you whole from my experience…

1 Like
26

It was a month of pain getting them to do what i pay them for…but paid off in end

27

Ah okay fair. Thank you for the clarification.

Yes opening up maps like that would be good.

Personally I cannot grasp the point of greyzone when enemy tanks can go into a safe zone and get free kills and the only way to kill them is aircraft which not everyone has or AT guns which are rarely able to be put in a position to shoot the greyzoners.
Plus existing AT guns struggle against higher rank tanks. (people forget that enemy tanks are usually facing you from the front and part of the problem with greyzone is precisely that you cannot flank, especially with infantry who will be auto killed by the game)
Out of Bounds should be either enforced or removed entirely.

In your idea we remove Out of Bounds completely and I think that’s a perfectly reasonable solution. After all there are various interesting areas of maps we never really get to use/explore.

If I were to critique this idea again my query would be this: Since Enlisted ultimately relies upon objectives, how do we stop this BIG game mode just being a regular battle but with more annoying snipers and tanks way out whoop whoop where no one can find them.

As in, everyone fighting over various parts of the map sounds cool. But then if the majority of players still have to congregate around a tiny point then that kind of defeats the purpose of opening up the whole map.

Maybe ‘the zone’ could be quite large with multiple ‘mini objectives’ within each major ‘battle area?’
Im a bit rusty on the names of Pacific maps (they are all the same to me)

But for the map Im thinking of it might be controlling the whole village/multiple buildings and the church rather than just one bungalow. The church is a specific mini objective, the 2 storey house is a mini objective and securing the other bungalows is necessary for a win.

Having ‘won’ that, you move on and now the manor is the new ‘battle area’ and you need to secure the entire manor plus the outbuildings, the fuel dump and the area over the river that is burnt out trenches.

I hope that makes sense.

That to me would be like a real life battle where the team is fighting over a certain area, and then each squad or group within a force is assigned a certain objective (such as capturing a church or securing a bridge or whatever), with all the different groups needing to capture their objectives before the army can move forward.

Note: Just to clarify I wouldnt have squads in Enlisted be assigned ‘objectives’ youd fight as normal and hopefully be smart enough to attack the objective that doesnt have as many people going for it.