As many people mention, the system is easy to abuse and people would just try hard to smuggle ARs and SFs as low as possible. Not for the sake of historical accuracy but just to face easier opposittion.
Map mm was probably better in middle ground between fair matches and historical accuracy on paper but devs made it so unpolished it was a meme.
such ratings are open to abuse. lets say you want to play Tiger II(H) and equip it with 3 squads full of kar98k. what will the BR be? or what if it is opposite where you equip pz2c with 3 squads of stg44 combined with kar98k?
e.g. KT is 1000 points and kar98k is 3x100 points. average is 325 points. how will low/mid tier player face KT?
also there is open area for abuse in taking 1 stg44 and 8 kar98k where you could easily just pickup that stg44 and use it again and again if you have ammo box, while enemy will be mostly be using BA rifles or weak semi auto carbines.
i have just taken breda PG (carcano) into tunisia and it is OP considering most opposition has BA rifles. i only have 4 rifles and it is easy to get loads of kills with it…
Yes. Personally, I think BR itself is not a very good form.
But that doesn’t mean there are no restrictions in free choices spaces for palyers. (Of course, for vehicles, the spawnCost system similar to mecha mode is better, it fundamentally prohibits spam) I have discussed related topics with you. These are not the subject of this article.
This suggestion just provides another form of BR implementation. (Its for BR not about spawn cost)
But as far as rating is used to guide players to conditionally set up their squads and participate in relatively fair competition, I think it is relatively good.
Yes, the player can carry a Tiger tank, but his infantry squad is more fragile and his opponent has a more average selection of weapons and equipment to fight against at the same rating level, which I think is fair.
The thing that really confuses me is the so called abuse scenario you guys describe, this will happens 100% in vanilla BR, 9 fg42s with only 1 fg42 newbie players, you guys take it for granted.
The example itself is the problem the OP is trying to address, and if they accept the imbalance then the example has no basis for rebuttal
Yes, maybe it’s unfair for 1 fg42+8 98k to face 4 pps43 + 2 svt? (maybe avenage rating BR described in OP )
So is it fair that 9 fg42s pinch a rookie with only 1 fg42? (vanilla BR)
yes it is if it allows you to bring e.g. KT in a match where they can be invulnerable to all weapons except planes.
do you think that KT + 3 98k squads is fair in a match with t-34 (1941) + 3 t3 BA squads? which of the 2 situations is worse?
you could have weighted average, but it would still be open to abuse. e.g. KT(H) is frontally basically invulnerable to all tanks besides IS2. there would be many other combinations that are simply OP and prone to abuse.
cause once that player gets into tiger he is basically invulnerable and can kill enemy infantry and vehicles with impunity. only counter to him is planes cause at that tier AT guns dont work, AT rifles dont work, most of the AT launchers dont work, not to mention tanks that cant pen frontally and even some cant pen from sides. also explosive packs are much less effective against KT.
this is basically normandy all over again with stuart vs tiger and m9 bazooka vs tiger and AT gun vs tiger. at least on normandy explosive packs worked if enemy tiger was stupid enough to come out of gray zone.
This is kind of related to another issue about spam.
But if you are really worried about the tiger, just increase the score of this vehicle.
Weapon scores can be based on superposition of powers of 10, mathematically distinguishing them.
For example
10
100
1000 (STG, Tiger stuffs)
Such a weapon that you think is powerful will have a huge impact on the rating, and Tiger won’t be matched up against opponents who can’t handle him at all.
Your concerns and the situation you describe are not incompatible with the way the topic describes it.
This topic only provides a more flexible idea than vanilla BR, without going into these specific numbers.
There is no doubt that these so-called abuse scenarios you describe will also occur in vanilla BR. Basically, players are prohibited from making any combinations and choices.
Unless you want to suffer, such as using a T-70 against a Tiger, even in vanilla BR, your example basically acknowledges that this approach is unplayable.
Most weapons on bots are just kinda wasted with how easiely they get wiped compared to how much use a players gets out of them so everyone equiping his bots will be severely disadvantaged.
You might even sneack in multiple high value weapons in if you only take 3 man squads. 1 high value weapon each for like 50 pts 2 boltaction for 10 points each and you end up cheaper than a 9 man rifle squad.
Does your squad have much staying power? No but it can nuke the enemy squads in the same way with more dakka and skilled players can abuse the smaller squad to sneak their squad into a position where the lack of numbers does not matter anyways.
It is a trade of yes but im sure people will do it anyway and eighter slaughter the enemy team or their own tickets depending on their own skill.
It might cause problems aswell if people stop taking AT weapons /Detpacks or their tanks to save score just to min/max their infantry (as game is decided mostly by infantry) and nobody in a lobby can deal with tanks or planes etc.
The only way to stop this really is to make high value weapons expensiv AF that if basicly turns into the next BR rank once you take any high value items.
i have already made a case of why it wont work
tiger =1000 points
t1 BA squad= 9x10= 90
t3 BA squad= 9x100 = 900
1 stg 44+8 kar98k= 1000+80=1080 btw such rating doesnt work for stg44
stg44 is also OP even if it is one weapon cause it can be picked up and you only need ammo box to make it deadly again.
If you think the former is playable in vanilla BR, then these so-called abuse examples above are contradictory.
This may not be a perfect solution, as I said I don’t like BR at all.
But this clearly balances players better than vanilla BR. If they really want to create balance as they claim.
With Vanilla BR It is difficult to completely match the types and quantities of weapons for each player. Vanilla BR doesn’t have much balance at all, it’s still just farming noobs and sweat lords fighting.
So you want MM just for people who run 3 STGs and a seperate queue for people who run 6 STGs in their squads?
How do you unify the search parameters if at the start every point of score matters with only 100ish score apart and in the end you are 40k score apart depending on the line up?
and that is choice of a player who takes such loadout. having 3x98k and tiger put into low/mid BR is unfair to players who dont have choice of loadout.
If the same advice was given as vanilla BR, anyone could find countless examples just from negative examples.
Due to the large number of weapons and their combinations in the game, it is very difficult to truly balance them through War Thunder’s vehicle BR.
None of the options actually provide a community-approved form of BR division, and since the developers claim to only be matching based on the best weapons, this means that the number itself has become a huge hole.
And this suggestion is to fill the balance hole caused by the difference in quantity.
Unless you really think that 1 fg42 + 8 98k and 9 fg42 fighting together is a very fair thing.
This is a squad-based game. The number of squad members will obviously affect the battle. Just one member carrying 1 weapon will treat the squad the same as a player fully equipped with advanced weapons.
yes it is fair. it is fair cause it is your choice to use high level BR equipment alongside low level BR equipment. it is fair cause other soldiers can take that 1 fg42 and use it.
what happens when you put such squad in low/mid level BR that actually doesnt have choice and that player at best has t1 or t3 BA rifle? player who made such squad can easily pick up that 1 OP weapon and abuse it.