Why we shouldn't make this game hardcore

[Tenjoin]

This is my video: Enlisted Teamkill Showcase - YouTube

I believe Enlisted never really attracted players who like hardcore FPS in the beginning. Anyone who like hardcore games would mostly turn to Post Scriptum/ARMA/Squad/RO.
Hence I would assume that most of(not everyone, of course) whom was intended to play this game, focus more on the entertaining of the game instead of various restrictions, rules and policies of the game(just like teamkill).
Say for example, typical Enlisted player would shoot on sight in the corner of houses, simply out of instinct or being intense. And they wouldn’t keep in mind to watch for friendly when driving tanks or planes, and friendly fire is just to hard to avoid because the available area of map(especially in invasions) is so darn narrow and there isn’t much space for infantry to go.
Particularly on aircrafts, they have much larger area to travel and much weaker sight comparing with ground forces, it would be really hard to know the combat situation for the first time. Also because driving aircraft is particularly harder, they have much higher chance to cause friendly fire. In my video, this P38 that caused multiple teamkill may not mean this - most likely he just didn’t choose the right angle to dive and miscalculated the aimpoint and timing of firing rockets, so we died.
In this video, I have recorded only one single battle to let you see how I overcame all these teamkills. In my usual playtime, I would be teamkilled 3-4 times on average in each battle.
So is it really that we should never take the flank or adopt other advanced tacticts simply because it is so easy to be teamkilled?
By hiding the HUD, basically I can still get information about map and battle by pressing 1, M and Tab repeatedly. But what is more ridiculous is as infantry, now playing infantry makes me feel that I wasn’t even a soldier but driving a “vehicle” made of flesh. I wouldn’t know when or where to mount the guns when crawling or in cover, I won’t know why I can’t build and in tank I don’t even know which part of my tank is damaged when I was hit. Do you think this is reasonable?
This update doesn’t not make the mode more hardcore, but makes my streaming and videos less fluent and cinematic because I need to keep manually “calling out” the informations I usually need constantly.

My last post: Please give us back the UI in lonefighter mode - English speaking section / Suggestions - Enlisted

[Tenjoin]

I double tap the go button, respawn and excecute a teammate instantly.

[voodoo_YT]

I come frome Hell let loose, squad and Post scriptum, and I love this game. Yesterday I played Lone Fighters for the first time since the update and is awesome.

I agree a minimal UI for planes because is impossible to know where is the enemy or where to refill ammo, but is not necessary for ground forces.

[Andris42]

@22205071

I would be teamkilled 3-4 times on average in each battle.

On one cap point I was surrounded by like 4 enemies, one injured me and I panic-retreated, then next guy entering got a headshot from me after looking at me and pointing his gun at me. He was a teammate, and I saw the triangle above him for like 5 seconds before killing him, just my mind failed to register it.
Afterwards I needed like 30 seconds on the spawn screen to get myself together, that headshot felt that bad.

Sorry for anyone being teamkilled by me!

@22205071

I double tap the go button, respawn and excecute a teammate instantly.

[LF] Add 5 sec friendly fire disable after spawn

I almost killed a teammate while waiting for spawn and switching between spawn locations and suddenly being put in-game. My last click on map was late by 0.1 sec and was registered as a shot, and the bullet was shot next to the guy with a 5 cm margin or so. I propose a 5 sec holdoff time for friendly fire in both directions right after spawn. This way a freshly spawned person would not be killed by some teammate’s shot happening in the spawn moment [so if I shoot through spawn location an enemy…

[DUROV196616]

Agree.
I think there would be better, if the Devs want to keep Hardcore, that do it, but with a different, separated mode. Bring back the simple Lone Fighter mode like in old times.

There is a lot of deficiency in Hardcore mode now…
Many instructions are missing, like “Press F button if you want to get in vehicle” and other simple texts as well to inform palyers about different things…interaction with vehilce/equipment etc…so dumb thing that they removed that simple thing…and i could keep sayng other problems…

I think theres would be good, if you kill someone teammate, the aim turns blue for a sec, and you got a message, like “that was a teammamte boi” (i know theres is message bottom of the screen, bot most of the players dont care about FF)

I hope they wont try Battle Royale ever at all…

[ErikaKalkbrenner]

i have seen alot of those posts regarding the hardcore lone fighter.

@22205071

I believe Enlisted never really attracted players who like hardcore FPS in the beginning.

well, yes, but at the same time, no.

the initial intent wasn’t hardocore that’s for sure.

but if you scroll through suggestions and lots of comments, i remember being filled with people asking for hardcore. so, the devs jus made those wishes truee.

which, i don’t think it has to be deleted. because, after all, devs decided to listen those suggestions, feedbacks and deliver.

my personal thought about this whole gamemode, it’s not bad, but not good either.

although, i have to admit that unfortunately did not " covered " the issue that was meant to adress. the lone fighter in the first place. while i love the hardcore, not everyone is suited for nor like it.

hardcore is more for slow phased battles, coordinates attacks, and above all, trigger discipline. so that avoids grenade spams, artillery spams, precise bomb runs, and many others more " serious " aspects instead of normal rush and kill that enlisted is used to.

so, perhaps the lone fighter it self and the hardcore should be separated gamemodes.

problem is, both requires works behind it. at the point where none of them are actually better than the other. and even further, splits the playerbase. and threads abot bots will rise even more.

and if you don’t mind, i would like to adress some of your points. not because " you are wrong and i’m right ". but because i’m not sure you are following the principles of the main intent in the first place.

@22205071

Say for example, typical Enlisted player would shoot on sight in the corner of houses, simply out of instinct or being intense. And they wouldn’t keep in mind to watch for friendly when driving tanks or planes, and friendly fire is just to hard to avoid because the available area of map(especially in invasions) is so darn narrow and there isn’t much space for infantry to go.

as far as i can see, lone fighters hardcore matches are having less team kills than the first times, because people are becoming catious. you don’t wanna lose xp, and therefore ruin someone else live. as such you don’t want to screw things off. and be actually like real life. where you know, you wait before shooting. that’s trigger discipline.

one of they key aspects of hardcore.

@22205071

Particularly on aircrafts, they have much larger area to travel and much weaker sight comparing with ground forces, it would be really hard to know the combat situation for the first time. Also because driving aircraft is particularly harder, they have much higher chance to cause friendly fire. In my video, this P38 that caused multiple teamkill may not mean this - most likely he just didn’t choose the right angle to dive and miscalculated the aimpoint and timing of firing rockets, so we died.

that’s somewhat also the main point.
you drive around, wait for a signal, and actually relay on coordination. not just drop a bomb and if you are luckly, you get alot of enemy kills with no backdraws. if you are not lucky, you just don’t kill any target and go back to refill.

in this way, airplanes have to play more " safier " and be more accurate in bomb runs. just to somewhat simulate real life pilots.

@22205071

So is it really that we should never take the flank or adopt other advanced tacticts simply because it is so easy to be teamkilled?

not really, you and the people that actually play LF, they have to adopt the trigger discipline, so that you avoid friendly fire accident.

@22205071

By hiding the HUD, basically I can still get information about map and battle by pressing 1, M and Tab repeatedly.

perhaps i agree that this system should be perhaps revisited. still don’t know how, but many things can be camed up with.

anyway,

@22205071

But what is more ridiculous is as infantry, now playing infantry makes me feel that I wasn’t even a soldier but driving a “vehicle” made of flesh. I wouldn’t know when or where to mount the guns when crawling or in cover, I won’t know why I can’t build and in tank I don’t even know which part of my tank is damaged when I was hit. Do you think this is reasonable?

i think it is reasonable.
but as i said, it just need lots of work.
( as i somewhat suggested in my previous thread: Lone Fighter: The Bad, The Good & The Ugly ( how to eventually fix it ) )

it just needs works behind it in order to fully make it functional.

@22205071

This update doesn’t not make the mode more hardcore, but makes my streaming and videos less fluent and cinematic because I need to keep manually “calling out” the informations I usually need constantly

well… that’s how hardcore works.

you see, i don’t particulary blain you, for not understanding something that you don’t like.

and i agree. people that used to play the older LF are not very confortable by playing the new LF. and therefore, people that used to play the LF i don’t see why they are obligued to play something that they don’t like.

i think, it’s just a matter of time before old lf it’s going to be reintroduced.

but on the other hand, it created the situation ( for me, and couple of others ) that we don’t like our hardcore getting removed. because we think, on our end, that hardcore is better than older LF.

so i hope that devs keep both of them.

but we’ll have to see.

one way or another, we’ll have to wait.

cheers.

[KV183]

Even I don’t agree to quite a lot of your ideas, I still need to say you are a true gentleman. I admire that.
I think keeping them both would be the most reasonable solution to this dilemma, as I also understand the flavor for hardcore. The reason against this would be, as you said before, splitting the playerbase.
I hate to admit it makes sense that gaijin shouldn’t have introduced LF at the beginning because we don’t have much active players to be splitted right now in 2021. New separate modes could work, but not right now.

I was also amazed when I checked his footages, seeing he did not kill any teammate in the church when teammates and enemy coming altogether. But shot by teammate.
What I want to supplement here is, when talking about disciplines, in most cases we can only ask ourself to do so, we can barely restrict the others to follow what we thought is “consensus”.

[Knyaz_Iaroslav]

Probably the most important problem of single fighters is online, there has never been a full team of the enemy or the team.

[ErikaKalkbrenner]

@68581318

Even I don’t agree to quite a lot of your ideas, I still need to say you are a true gentleman.

i’m… not a gentelman, like, i’m not a man in the first place .

but, thanks for the kind words

@68581318

I think keeping them both would be the most reasonable solution to this dilemma

agreed.

@68581318

as I also understand the flavor for hardcore. The reason against this would be, as you said before, splitting the playerbase.

i see. and if i have to be honest, i can’t be really angry towards the removal of hardcore. although, brings something new, and fun for me. it would be sad that they are going to remove just when it has been introduced.

but if it’s for the “good” of the game, so be it.

@68581318

I hate to admit it makes sense that gaijin shouldn’t have introduced LF at the beginning because we don’t have much active players to be splitted right now in 2021. New separate modes could work, but not right now.

indeed.
enlisted wasn’t really ment to be LF. but people kept asking, and after all, can’t blain them as delivered incomes for those who don’t like bots.

and one more gamemode kills the playerbase as it’s somewhat, " small ".

@68581318

I was also amazed when I checked his footages, seeing he did not kill any teammate in the church when teammates and enemy coming altogether. But shot by teammate.

mistakes happens. and that was very unfortunate. can’t conplain there.

and perhaps, as i mentioned somewhere else, the hardcore shouldn’t be avaialbe for everyone until a certain level ( perhaps level 10. so people know what to do and know how the games work) . but i don’t know.

@68581318

What I want to supplement here is, when talking about disciplines, in most cases we can only ask ourself to do so, we can barely restrict the others to follow what we thought is “consensus”.

yeah, some system should be introduced as well. and that’s the prooblem of leaving the ability to everyone to play this gamemode.

but i’m confident that with time, ( as i somewhat saw ) team kills decrease each time, because people can become smart after getting kicked from the match for many tks.

but that’s what i think.

best regards.

[KV183]

@ErikaKalkbrenner

as i mentioned somewhere else, the hardcore shouldn’t be avaialbe for everyone until a certain level ( perhaps level 10. so people know what to do and know how the games work) . but i don’t know.

I never saw this but this is a darn good idea.

@ErikaKalkbrenner

but i’m confident that with time, ( as i somewhat saw ) team kills decrease each time, because people can become smart after getting kicked from the match for many tks.

It’s been like 3 days since the update and I don’t see significant improvement till now. I am also waiting. Teamkill isn’t really that torturing, but is greatly amplified by hidden HUD.

God, I wish the devs could just make a schedule instead of throw out everything immediately without discussing. Maybe they did, but I can’t see.

[GeneralBrus]

The main reason why I play this game is the one shot kills, that already is by definition of many a “hardcore” game,

Now team kills and a missing HUD are kinda fitting, but they dont need to be a thing for me to enjoy playing the game.
Then again, I only play the squad mode, in my opinion the “lone fighter mode” would only make sense to me, if there wasn’t any AI at all, also spawning next to your teammates reminds me why I hate the modern Battlefield games, really destroys the “flow” of the game.

[Knyaz_Iaroslav]

You can play in lone fighters from 3 lvl campaing

[Tenjoin]

I agree to keep the LF and hardcore mode both.

[Knyaz_Iaroslav]

Then the number of lone fighters will decrease completely

[ErikaKalkbrenner]

personally, i wouldn’t mind playing with bots.

at the end of the day, if the game allows me and others to play their favorite gamemode i guess it’s the best.

but as far as i’m seeing, people still complain about LF made out of bots.

so i don’t know… i don’t speak for everyone.

[Knyaz_Iaroslav]

It’s fun to play against bots,but either the entire opposing team is bots and yours too, or you don’t have to.Either balance 5 players against 5 players and 15 bots each.

[Knyaz_Iaroslav]

@ErikaKalkbrenner

i don’t speak for everyone.

The one who speaks for everyone is a liar.

[Tenjoin]

Do you play Allied? I want to add your friends in the game

[LordRig]

I don’t agree, because I like hardcore. What I do agree with is the simple control hints and hud that can stay. They can just make two modes, hardcore and regular. I would like to play hardcore on squad as well. The bad thing about hardcore is the occasional troll that comes and and knocks you around or breaks your stuff. I had one kid that kept killing me, and I just started hunting him down. That whole game was just me hunting this kid down until he eventually left.

[ErikaKalkbrenner]

@22205071

Do you play Allied?

i play both ( germany a bit more)

@22205071

I want to add your friends in the game

you’re not the first one

but due to my lack of time, i generally only play during weekends with a bouch of friends.

nothing personal, but i don’t usually play with people that i don’t know.
due to bad experiences and just like i tried on a discord one time, i’m barely active to even try to keep up with all the friends that i made over the years.

i know it sounds a weird brag, and you could argue that i somewhat use this forum more than i play ( which it’s somewhat truee ), but as i said in others comments, it’s easier for me to use the forum due to " dead " times in my day. ( on public transports, waiting, smart working, yada yada yada ).

so i’m afraid this cannot be done.

Sorry, .