Should Enlisted put more emphasis on commanding the bots?

Mess Room
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I simply want to know the opinion of the community.

My thoughts:

Yes, it should. Currently we “command” bots but it’s simply not nearly as effective as old fasioned run&gun. So while AI squads are the main feature of the game, they don’t really matter that much.

In 90% of my games I could remove my AI squad and instead add a squad system like in BF. In BF I run with squad of dudes I don’t really care about and when I die I just respawn on one of them. In Enlisted I run with squad of AI I don’t really care about and when I die I just switch to one of them.

While I can command my AI, it often requires quite a bit of effort to get mediorate results. I’ll probably do more by forgetting about my squad and plaing it like any other shooter.

I’m not asking to make this game into an RTS, at least not fully. But currently we have very few ways of commanding our squads and it feels not worth the effort to do it at all. And imo AI squads is a wasted potential.

At the same time I’d say that Enlisted was clearly not designed to be played like this. Bots are meant to be a meatbags to shoot at, a spare life and a weapons cabinet.

11 Likes
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Bots survability have to be increase first to make it worth it.

The bots are becoming more and more smart. Now they can take cover in some buildings.

It just still feel buggy to try to give orders to your squad. Most of time, micromanagement hurt their potential. And 3 bot with MG just following you without orders are the most efficient way to use it.

This game require better AI. At least AI that know how to take cover.
Right now 90% of fight against AI or bots go like this.

  1. shoot close to the AI
  2. the AI react: stop moving/aim or get on the ground/aim
  3. I kill the AI because it has become an easy target.
  4. Go to step 1.
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I try to command them, but I would definitely like them to be more effective, and have better tools on how to direct them than point, press x, and hope they go where I want.

Still better than having randoms as squadmates as you can at least count on them being in the right general area.

3 Likes
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Need to strengthen the pathfinding function and viability of AI

These fools will not seek shelter, see the explosives will not disperse, will not evade shelling.

They can’t find their way smoothly on some maps, and they can’t go downstairs. They often get stuck in some complicated places, especially the ups and downs

Many times they didn’t listen to my orders. I often pressed X in a safe building, and later found that they ran outside.

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Only commands I bother giving bots are hold orders and build orders. Don’t see the point in using any other commands since most of them will die in 5 seconds anyway.

2 Likes
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Would love to add some commands like “get out of the spawn and follow me! Yes! Out of the spawn point that I’ve already left minutes ago, yes that spawn point, leave it!”

and specific tunisian map like “I’m just in the pit, near the tunel! Follow me in the tunel, not above! Yeah, get down. No, no, not backward, no please don’t take the other tunels that go to the opposite way, take MY tunels”

and a specific comand to insult the bot’s mother could be relaxfull also

1 Like
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For me, controlling the AI is a huge aspect of how I play and should be something that is continually updated and improved on. But should continue to be considered a gameplay enhancement rather than a necessary mechanic, and here’s why:

It introduces more skill expression to the game. Squad AI in particular provides a very high skill ceiling because of the large number of tactics and possibilities across the various maps and modes. A player shouldn’t have to focus on this aspect of gameplay until later on when they get experience and familiarity with the maps. Then they can look at managing squads more closely.
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I know a lot of people like to shit on Bots for dying easily, but if I am being honest, it is your own fault for not placing them properly. Staggering them to protect you and your moving AI. Or even more advanced moves like splitting your AI to the blindside of a tank you are distracting so you can switch and blow it up.

While they aren’t perfect, there is still a lot of functionality in the game with them at the moment, but if the devs can improve anything it would be these things:

  • Faster response time to their orders (altho the recent update to this has been great)
  • Their pathfinding. Asking to heal or give ammo is agonizing sometimes. And they often take crazy routes to go to locations I order them to.
  • Formations should have more of an effect, it is currently barely noticeable. AI moving and/or taking defensive positions in buildings should be based on the formation as well
  • More General and class-specific orders such as place mines, flamethrower here, mortar here, etc

This would put squad management in the best possible place.

2 Likes
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i would be happy with just some kind of cover command. btw can we get some armor for radio guy… i think that he always dies first…

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I think the “AI squad” aspect is the key draw card of Enlisted. There is no other point or reason in playing this game.

The manner and effectiveness in which Gaijin/Enlisted effectively work through this conundrum will determine whether they can reach the critical mass currently enjoyed by WT.

Fighting as “the Squad” is precisely the novelty that I enjoy in Enlisted. They have an opportunity here to provide players with a good blend of gaming abstractions and levels of authenticity eroded in other games by the over emphasis on the player as a 1 man army.

I think once they satisfy the “goldfish” crowd, that just thrives on “new” whatever form that may take, as well as finalising this new Pacific extravaganza, I hope they take a step back and look at improving the interaction between AI and the active player, to ensure that the squad acts more logically to its immediate situation.

Some basic concepts are to create a “squad leader” based, more immersive, set of orders which combine formations, AI reaction to the environment, and squad quality into a more immersive experience. . I’d even go so far as to see an RTS like morale layer where some soldiers based on their experience level may refuse to follow orders and notify the squad leader in some manner. Perhaps the SL may have to pull the squad back out of the line of fire to help them recover, lots of possibilities here. However, before they get to this there is a more fundamental body of work that needs to be done to enable this

The key here is fixing AI awareness of its environment.

The AI bots need to be re-trained on all the maps as part of the dev cycle. This is why map design is so important, if they screw it up the bots will have to be re-trained an that takes time. Once the bots are trained on the map, and this includes understanding which map artifacts block pathing, which block LOS inclusive of vegetation, fence lines, and most importantly battlespace/environmental effects being coded into the game like smoke from burning buildings/vehicles or fog/mist/dust or rain that are randomly generated during a game, they can take the next step.

So as it stands, the proposed graphics changes are nice, but they feed the “goldfish”, what is sorely needed is some hard yards, and I’m talking months, of instructed AI learning of all the maps so that a dev can individually optimise each role for every type of building, bunker, trench etc, in how the bots use cover to move to them and how they realisically ingress and egress these, to form the foundation for the C2 overlay.

2 Likes