Make BR4 unable to uptier to BR5. Make BR5 only queue against BR5 for all factions

  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

The power level increase from BR4 to BR5 is the largest leap anywhere in the battle rating system. Every faction goes from 10 round semi automatic rifles in their tech tree such as the Gewehr 43 and SVT-40 to fully automatic battle rifles with double the capacity such as the FG42 and AVT-20

On top of that, BR4 tanks such as most Shermans and the T34-85 don’t stand any chance at all against BR5 vehicles such as the Ho-Ri production or King Tiger

Because of this extremely large power disparity between BR4 and BR5, I propose that BR4 should be unable to uptier which means BR5 will only face BR5. For every faction. This would make BR4 much more enjoyable to play as the last BR before vehicle spam and full-auto spam take full effect. It’s also the last BR before jet aircraft are available which many people dislike.

The BR4 environment features an interesting equipment lineup of the best semi-auto rifles, solid medium tanks and some early heavy tanks, and solid SMGs. However, because BR5 features equipment that is radically more powerful (battle rifles, assault rifles, heavy tanks), most people are not willing to play BR4 specifically. If BR4 would be free from uptiers, it would create an environment where people could play with equipment that often does not get seen.

11 Likes

No, not until we get +/-0 for all BR.

Having BR4 bing always matched against BR3 won’t solve the problem.

Yes BR4 as of now is terrible, I am not saying otherwise. However, locking BR5 would just make BR4 always being downtiered. BR3 would become the new BR4 and simply won’t be fun.

Particularly, BR4 was completly neglected by the Devs over the last few months (years?) Some factio. Don’t even have basic BR4 rifle. Meaning that it would be difficult for some faction to compete against each other.

Let alone BR3 being an uptier hell.

Yes, something has to be done about BR4. But imo, locking BR5 (without locking all BR) is not the right solution.

5 Likes

I generally think the power disparity between the other BR tiers isn’t as extreme as BR4 → BR5 so I don’t mind it. Like, a Lee-Enfield vs a G41 isn’t that big of a deal. But going from a G43 to a AVT-40 is a completely different world

5 Likes

That’s completly true. BR4 to BR5 has the biggest power gap.

But, being honest, I must say that BR4 has been dead to me since the merge (I tried to play it, I really tried, but It wasn’t fun). And I quite like the game how it is now. I would rather see BR4 dead than killing BR3.

I am open to testing : for instance a 1 week testing of such feature just like what happened to the “All BR, all Maps” feature.

But I will be sceptical of such a change in the meantime.

4 Likes

it wont but the gap is way smaller thus it would still be a massive improvement.

4 Likes

Yep, all exceptions in this matter are toxic by nature toxic. And creates their own meta issues.

2 Likes

0/0 for all. However we still have the one huge obstacle that has ignored our requests for years. Gaijin… :no_good_man: The last time they actually promised they’d do something about it they gave us the “preferred map/mode” shit show, and so far have done NOTHING I know of to correct it. So, I don’t foresee them doing anything about it until the player numbers drop to the point they get desperate. :grin:

1 Like

I voted “Yes” because I want to be allowed to enjoy classic WW2 stuff such as SVT40, G43, Sherman 76mm, T-34-85, Panther, etc. without being instantly sent to BRRRR laser gun fakeland of AS, AF, T20 and Su-9 1946.

However, my preferred solution would be adding a “fantasy” BR 6 with ±0 MM, where all the oppressive wonderful creatures such as RD, Hyde AR, Hori, etc., T-44, T-54, T-64 + even FG 42 2 for all I care could go and duke it out against each other, even with all factions FFA on random maps, if they want that.

6 Likes

Make +0- matchmaking instead. No need to make confusing br rules if we just get rid of up and downtiers completely.

4 Likes

An enormous disparity in combat strength has emerged between each BR bracket. Unless BR±0 is implemented immediately, the bottom bracket side will simply be slaughtered.

1 Like

Not gonna lie this would lock all jets to BR5.
BR4 tanks would not need to deal with Tiger II, Superpersh, Ho-Ri ect.
No need to nerf SF rifles, no need to buff BR4 either.
Good solution :+1:

1 Like

That’s a pretty good idea. Currently, the only BR range where players can achieve balanced offense and defense is BR 1–4. The leap to BR 5 is just too massive right now—no one dares risk being slaughtered by BR 5 vehicles while using BR 4’s less accurate, half-ammo semi-autos as primary weapons. At the moment, 1–4 is balanced, but BR 5 really represents a huge jump in quality. Often, when players finally reach BR 4, they get taught a brutal lesson by the overwhelming firepower of BR 5 veterans, beaten so badly they don’t even recognize themselves, and end up slinking back to the most balanced BR 3 to grind experience until they’ve fully researched BR 4.

Here’s the current situation: BR 1 can fight BR 2. Though the gap between them is big—like the appearance of APCs and large-caliber HE shells—such cases are relatively rare, and it mostly stays within the realm of bolt-action rifles going head-to-head.

Between BR 2 and 3, there’s a certain degree of parity, largely depending on player skill. Sure, there are issues—like Japan lacking Tier II aircraft that can spawn in the air instead of on carriers, and Germany lacking anti-tank options at BR 2 (missing the StuG III F/G, for example)—but overall, BR 2–3 is still playable. BR 3 only feels so good right now because hardly anyone plays BR 4. Think about it: compared to BR 5 weapons, BR 4 primaries not only have half the ammo but are also semi-automatic. That’s a bigger power gap than any previous jump in the game! Right now, the options are either introducing BR 6 and filling BR 5 with a bunch of new 10-round full-autos, while moving 15+ round full-autos, tanks like the Tiger II, M26, T-44/100, IS-3, and jet aircraft to BR 6 to create a smoother transition. But doing that would be exhausting and might require halting updates for half a year, so it’s unlikely to happen.

The situation with restricting BR 4 can be compared to Japan’s performance early after the merge: the U.S. had the Calliope, the Jumbo, the P-47… What did Japan have? Just one BR 4 copy of the Garand. Everything else was BR 2 anti-tank weapons and un-buffed BR 3 firearms. I’ve played it—it was like the Malevelon Creek war in Helldivers 2, with explosives, HE rounds, rockets, grenades, and full-auto fire never letting up, absolutely crushing Japan. Their win rate plummeted from a roughly 50/50 split with the U.S. before the merge to nearly 0%. Eventually, the developers had to step in and save Japan by locking matchmaking at BR 4, preventing BR 3 from being dragged into BR 4 matches. To this day, that protection—like an insurance policy—still shields Japan from things like the dreaded U.S. bombing runs.

Now, BR 4 isn’t as severe as Japan’s case was, but just check the developer’s backend data—BR 4 players are as rare as pandas. You either have fresh newcomers who just reached it, players gambling by sticking to BR 3, or people with a masochistic streak. I tried queuing with a German BR 4 squad to try and match against the USSR, but five matches in a row were against the U.S. We gave up using BR 5 vehicles like the Tiger II and the 42/22, and got absolutely suffocated by rockets and the T-20, to the point where we finally gave up on BR 4 altogether and just went back to either BR 5 or BR 3.

So, based on actual cases and my personal experience, I support putting a separation between BR 4 and BR 5. This would save BR 4, restore a normal experience for players grinding through the tech tree, and keep BR 5 fun enough that people will still play it.

So then BR3 becomes the punching bag because people start playing BR4 since they wont get uptiered. I think BR5 just needs to get decompressed and the broken stuff pushed into BR6, then they could leave it like that for a bit or introduce a ±0 matchmaking if need be. But this suggestion really wouldn’t fix anything.

1 Like

See Im not so sure of that.

BR4 lacks the same cancer that sits in BR5, aka the SF meta. That alone would completely change the relationship between BR4vsBR3 in regards to the similarities as between BR5vsBR4.

I mean the rare few BR4 matches I get playing as BR3 I have always enjoyed without fail, I never feel outgunned in small arms, and all BR4 vehicles are beatable by BR3 vehicles, even if it requires getting a little creative.

But yes, Japan and the US should get BR4 Semi Autos as well, ideally everyone could get a 10-20 round detachable mag Semi.

I dare say, if this update goes through to protect BR 4, it will go down as a legendary move in Enlisted history—just like when they saved Japan at BR 3 back then. I’d be overjoyed and would gladly spend money to start building BR 4 lineups—Jumbos, double-engine BF 109s, IS-2s facing off against tanks other than the Tiger II… How glorious!

All my frustrations over the years—the unacknowledged Soviet stealth-nerfs, the intentional weakening of Soviet battle pass weapons, the half-hearted and sabotaged Soviet updates, the lazy copy-paste of the New Manchuria Chinese battlefield using assets from Burmese buildings (stairs, colors), Moscow interior layouts, Berlin railroads, Stalingrad walls, and Tunisian bunkers—all of that would fade away because of this change. Even the most bitter critics (not my words) would say this would allow Anton’s mother to return from space and live peacefully on Earth again!

From now on, I’ll do my best to keep this thread active. This idea is truly excellent—far superior to some of the suggestions about splitting matchmaking by individual BR levels.

Bro, I think you might be over-worrying—if we implement a matchmaking ratio of 4:6 between BR X and BR (X-1), it could actually solve the issue.
By ensuring that no more than one BR 4 player exists per match—since BR 4 still relies heavily on semi-autos as infantry primaries—the gap compared to full-auto weapons becomes much smaller.

Plus, if this goes live, Germany at BR 4 could become the strongest rival to the Soviets at BR 3.
The StG 44—the ultimate assault rifle—would provide powerful support for German BR 3 teams.
That means even without introducing new 88mm turret carriers (like the VFW or Rheinmetall 88), German BR 3 gameplay could still improve significantly.

It’s a smart way to balance matchmaking while making use of existing weapons and mechanics.
This could add an interesting layer to the mid-tier battles without requiring massive content updates.

Keep pushing for this idea—it sounds like a solid step toward better balance.

In the end, this requires careful consideration. Many players only know that BR 5 is strong and BR 3 is viable, but they only have a partial understanding of BR 4’s situation—just that it gets crushed by BR 5. Once this suggestion is put forward, some might worry that BR 4 would bring overpowered elements that could ruin BR 3 matches. But honestly, that’s overthinking it.

In the earlier campaign modes—Tunisia, Pacific, Stalingrad, and Normandy—these were typical examples where weapons or vehicles capped at BR 4, and they ran smoothly back then without any major balance issues. So we should provide more examples and explanations. After all, four of the past campaigns were very well balanced—all of them capped at BR 4! History has already proven it: without BR 5 in the mix, a BR 4–max environment would at least not be as miserable as the current situation where BR 4 faces top-tier opponents.

The only imbalance I ever really felt back then was in Moscow, where Germans were still using the ZH-29 while the Soviets already had the KV-1 and AVS-36. And in Berlin, the Germans had an extra five rounds over the Soviet AVT, but the Soviets didn’t yet have the assault rifle advantage at the time.

This, however, laid the groundwork for the current imbalance between Germany and the Soviet Union at BR 3/5 and the whole “paying back the debt” argument. Still, back when I played those four campaigns starting from Rank I, I had a consistently enjoyable experience. The others… well, you could only really play one faction—mostly because the other side had emptied out.

1 Like

Personally, I prefer to see a new br6 for jets and things like this.

I don’t want to play in br4 against jets, and proto AK/lazer guns / paper tanks / full meta guns actually.

3 Likes

Before the merge, it was rare to encounter hvar spammer in Normandy or heavy tiger in Berlin (in my expérience), or full squads with fg42 / proto AK.
We were abble to run a squad with stg + kar and a panzer 3 and deal with the opposant. Now, you had to use the meta for hight br with best gears.

2 Likes

Yes, BR4 is stronger and does sort of beat down on BR3 but the jump isn’t large enough to cause the problems BR4 suffers right now. The SVT-38 on BR3 is like a BR4 weapon and while I think it should be nerfed to remain at BR3 it’s not an insurmountable problem the huge jump from BR4 to BR5 is.

Also so many weapons are just lying dead in BR4, the TT is filled with weapons too weak for BR5, event weapons like the suppressed PPD and Cei Rigotti are just worse options at BR5 and with so many uptiers in BR4 they sadly just sit in inventories for the entire time.

2 Likes