If we could see what the next point is before we lose the first one would help Engineers set up defenses. Also helps people place mines better. Among other reasons I’m confident there is only one downside, that people will focus the next objective instead of trying to clutch the current one still active.
9 Likes
I still think defenders need to be able to see ALL objectives at all times, because some objectives simply aren’t good no matter how much you attempt to fortify them.
At least by being able to see all of them, you can set more mines and other defenses further in advance to make a difference.
Despite some people complaining that I should be on the front line assisting my team all the time, I’ve actually had FAR more players message me after the game saying they were glad that I went back in advance (like 2 objectives back) to set up. It can make a HUGE difference by creating actual choke points and hazards that the enemy is otherwise not anticipating.
GOOD ENGINEER MAINS are not a large amount of the playerbase, but even 1 per team with enough time can often change the outcome of the game by making it easier for his team to effectively hold a position.
4 Likes
I’m losing track on how many times this topic has been brought up At this point
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I understand the sentiment but in the game as of now sometimes it just takes a little intuition. For example, with mines you can always have a rough idea of where the objective is going so you have a general area to place them. I’ve also had success building what defenses I can during the scramble to the next objective; as well as during the fight for said objective.
Usually there are lull periods after each enemy wave attack so you have a little time to make defenses
Sometimes that’s not enough, and in my experience there are some objectives you can’t just place and guess because their in two perpendicular directions.
2 Likes
Exactly. In my experience with objectives that are in 2 different directions, is that if I set up defenses at the one that it almost always goes to, it will always go to the other one.
At this point I honestly believe there is a built in mechanic that stops an objective from going to a location solely based on how many fortifications it has built near it.
It will always go to the LEAST defended location.
This is why I usually go all the way back to like the 3rd or 4th point on a lot of maps, where the objective only goes to one location.
There are some that complain that I pull that far back, but there are definitely MORE people that end up thanking me and sending me a gg afterwards for taking the time to set up quality defenses.
Do not agree. A defending force would not know beforehand what an attacker’s objective might be or is, in most cases.
3 Likes
Except it’s the other way around. At least imo.
It’s not: atackers want to capture a random house and deffenders want to prevent this for some reason.
It’s: deffenders set up defdence in a random house as a strongpoint to hold the ground and atackers have to push them away to continue the assault.
In such scenario it’s perfectly resonable for deffenders to know where their main points of rezistance will be located.
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How do you go so far back? I find there’s a limit to going back that far.
Generally speaking, you can go back up to at least the front section of 2 objectives back from the current one.
Considering that the first objective usually falls really quickly, that gives full access to 3rd objective and the front of the 4th.
Depending on the map and the campaign, I’ll often start out with my squads that are packing AT mines and have increased melee speed on the engineers (which currently are often radio operators so I can drop artillery to support my team, while I’m setting up fortifications for further support). I’ll get Czech Hedgehogs and mines set up as “Gates” so that tanks that push through get messed up by the mines, while our tanks are allowed to move through freely until then.
I set a rally to the side, in front of the objective I’m working on. This way it not only helps with keeping spawns going toward the front objective, but keeps people (when they are intelligent) away from the field of hazards).
The melee speed perk allows me to start trenching quickly, as I ALWAYS trench my wire (its too easy to destroy otherwise). This allows me to set hazard zones to slow enemies, and kill zones for machine gun coverage. All of which is still out in FRONT of the objective, so even if it hasn’t opened up far enough for me to work on the objective ITSELF, the field out front will be prepared.
The AP mine squads and engineer squads usually follow suit after that.
The AP mine squads are usually rifleman or assaulter squads, I set the mines in flank areas predominately, this way not only will it eliminate soldiers coming from that way for a short while, but if its players, the start getting paranoid and try a different route, hopefully forcing them through hazards up front.
Additionally, I set a few mines just behind the wire lines, so if people jump the wire, they step on the mines. Again, this is to push them to move through killzones, as in my experience, people will take their chances against a MG nest rather than against minefields.
Once I set the groups mines down, I send them to the point, and keep working with my engineer until I switch squads again.
Occasionally I’ll even dig foxholes out front for the enemy to cluster up in… but its in clear sight of where my buddy snipes from…
All of this setup is BERFORE the actual objective!
IF I manage to get all those fortifications in, great. Usually however I just have to prioritize according to map.
On the actual objective itself, (H)MG nests covering killzones, sandbag cover for them where I can, which is very difficult since they stupidly removed sandbag stacking, sandbag the important front windows, set another sandbag on the ground behind them at key locations, and set an ammo box next to that.
Note: I know some people were angry with the ability to stack sandbags in doorways, but if it were made to where you can’t double stack within 2m of a doorway, it would be fine. Stacking them inside the doorway would still give necessary cover while allowing ease of passage.
This way there is much greater protection against small arms fire, flamethrowers, and grenades, while still providing areas from which to mount a defense.
The only really major issues are how quickly the enemies can take down defensive structures, especially sandbag walls. Fragmentation damage should NOT damage them. If that were fixed, it would be a lot better gameplay. Additionally, it requires an engineer to build them, the enemy should not be able to deconstruct them without a consumable or an engineer themselves.
Long explanation I know, but the reality is that most people don’t stop to consider that the defensive engineer mains really are sacrificing the chance for points at the first couple objective in order to set up effective defenses as you are moving back.
Setting up the FRONT of the objective can be just as important as setting up the objective itself.
And it REALLY changes how the game plays when you do. Its a lot more interesting for both defenders AND attackers.
1 Like