Engineer 2.0 + Season Pass

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In Rainbow Six Siege - one of the most popular mmo-fps(questionable but you got me) - replayability is supported for 5 years by the seasonal addition of new operatives with UNIQUE devices. This practice saves the game from dying for 5 YEARS.
Why is this necessary:

To support online seasons the UNIQUE units and UNIQUE buildings.
To make existing units more playable. In fact, you can have 2 assault squads and a lmg-platoon. And you’re on top. Trust me. Why I dont need other squads at all? Tanks took my explosives, the team has my point of rebirth, enemies- got 73 rounds in the face in 6 seconds. At a long distance I can use my 2 stars carabine as well. Thats All, folks.
So, how to reduce the shortage of engineers and increase their favor in the game without breaking the balance?
In short, the essence - the engineer of the squad can ONLY build their own unique buildings + sandbags and hedgehogs.
Which unique structures will the enginer units in squads may have? Lets go!

Lmg squad - ammunition. The consumption of ammunition of machine gunners is the largest in theory, so they will be the most relevant in ammunition. After the stormtroopers, but it’s not a good idea to reinforce them more.

Rifleman - stationary machine gun. Let me explain, the task of shooters is rather defensive (as opposed to the ubiquitous stormtroopers), the machine gun will strengthen their defense capabilities and support the attack against buffed assaults.

AT-squad - AT-gun. Now there is no point in playing armor-breakers at all. I saw two tanks by my stormtrooper, got out of the trench and distributed a briquette of explosives, tanks down. To get tank with a PTRD i need a flank and aim the entire tank crew. So long. Adding a gun as a unique object to the armor-piercing platoon enginer will give them a greater advantage for the game.

Communicators. Who plays them? Well, seriously, what is the point of 4 radio operators, if the break between the art is still fixed. The solution is to give a respawn point ONLY to them. Next, a special opinion: Let’s make the point of rebirth WIRED. How is it? An operator with a coil over his shoulders pulls the wire from the common spawn point to the place he needs and installs a WIRED switchboard (telephone, spawn point). Communication during the war consisted almost entirely of wire points, to which it was infernally difficult to bring the wire. This is associated with a number of heroic acts, when the communicator clamped a wire in their teeth, shooting back.
The enemy is also interested - found the wire, went, looked, found spawn point. The engineer can cut the wire. Lots of mechanics and tactics!
This is a whole new mechanic and mini-game-the wire is stretched so that it is barely noticeable. At the same time, you can not be arrogant and put a point behind the enemy’s back. BUT the question is - what about radio communication, it was also during WWII!

Солдат связист с катушкой
Солдат связист с катушкой1098×1586 631 KB

BINGO! Premium squads of paratroopers and partisans will own a radio point can be build there you want it to be. The guerrillas will attack from unexpected places, as they should. Light weapons and a minimum of heavy weapons correspond to reality. On the German side, paratroopers will have hervorragende Waffe - special ops guns.
F8-Zelenyj-kostyanoj-meshok-desantnika-vermahta
Snipers - their engineers will be able to build a closed sniper position or a fake person. I doubt it a little, but on the other hand, such a scarecrow in the window will cause fire and show the enemy’s position to the sniper.

NEW PREMIUM SQUAD: Paramedic - engineer can complete the infirmary. The infirmary treats fighters and allows you as filed medic to take one first-aid kit at a time.
The Soviet medical corps - girls. I know you guys argue with that but according to various estimates, the Red Army served from 600 thousand to 1 million representatives of the beautiful half of humanity, most of them was a paramdeic, including field ones. This can and should be reflected. In addition, anime fans will appreciate the variety of artworks on this theme.
German Sanitator! a strong person, healing genius with his sleeves rolled up and a stretcher slung over his shoulders.
post-2447-1243865737
Stormtroopers- I suggest that the engineers of stormtroopers give out a minimum, since the squad is now objectively more powerful than all the others by one and a half times.

Mortars. Let the engineer build a position with ammunition special for a mortar - 40-50 shots (not the thousands like now) + smoke shells.

Engineers-sappers. They have the most interesting thing - a disruptive wire charge. Put 40 kg of explosives, pulled the wire, sat down, wait. In the most likely direction of course. There is a horde comes. Get it! 10 frags. This charge can use the same technology as the wired spawn point and be no less useful, especially in defense. The practice of using such charges is in Company of heroes 2. And you can`t place it directly on the capture point.

Flamethrower. Their engineers can dig in the FOG-1 (and german analog) directional one time use flamethrower - a jet of fire is released in one direction for 20 meters. The difference from the charge is that the direction is a line, not a circle.

I will be grateful for criticism, suggestions and edits to the idea. The most important thing is to make the game live. The experience of Rainbow Six must be taken into game to maintain the interest of players. the proven technology will allow you to purchase units both separately or through the season pass.

And my best regards to the developers for their work and attention to feedback and suggestions. Darkflow - you are the best! So, keep calm and Hurrahh!

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This is little bit P2W smelly, but good ideas.

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I wouldnt mind having the engineers of specific squads being able to only build the general buildings and 1 specialized building, and have the dedicated engineer squad build all.

However, I very much dislike the idea of paramedics and to that extend, female soldiers.
Paramedics do not really have a place in Enlisted. You can already heal downed allies as any squad, a building that restores medkits would be OP and encourages camping around it.

Female soldiers would be very expensive to set up, requiring new models, new voice lines, and more. On top of that, they either have to be modelled as wearing potato bags, or they would have smaller hitboxes. Big nono.

We do not need season passes to keep the playerbase alive. We need incentive for new players to join the game. Right now, there is none:

new players come in with 13 damage rifles

face enemies with 18 damage rifles, SMGs, MGs, mortars, 35% more health, much lower recoil, or faster reloading, more medkits, more grenades, full squads (player+6 AI instead of player+3 AI)

you have to grind for months in such horrible conditions just to get at even ground

progression for weapons either goes through the totally random loot box, or through the ones that “guarantee a drop every X opens”, yet they do not guarantee a drop in said X opens, and later variants of those cost 2 orders instead of 1, and they do not drop any equipment, like medkits or grenades

you need around 620 hours to level rank 1 soldiers to a single rank 5 veteran soldier, asuming it takes an average of 10 minutes to level up a single soldier up by 1 level.

im fairly sure non-premium players can even get their squads maxed, thanks to the limit to the ammount of soldiers you can have in your inventory/reserves
they would have to rely on luck from the crates to get random rank 4-5 soldiers, which have a <1% drop rate

planes are effectively blind and therefore useless outside of bombing known spawn locations, chokepoints or capture zones and tankers get improved targeting speed at higher ranks

on top of that, some <0.01% of players might never be able to get upgraded weapons, which, mind you, give +20% fire rate and +20% damage for SMGs and LMGs, and less recoil and +20% damage on rifles. Because you have a random range of parts that you get when disassebling weapons, which you then have to gather to upgrade a gun. Upgrades past 1 star have a chance to fail, so, again, some people might just straight up fail every upgrade and get stuck with weapons that deal 20% less damage

mind you, you need that +20% damage to somewhat reliably oneshot the premium soldiers that have +35% health

take all of this, and a new player just runs away from the game right away. There is next to no new blood coming in. A game is only successful if the ammount of new players coming in is greater than the ones leaving. Sure, you can partially achieve that by making players stay longer by adding season passes, but if there are no new players, the game will die regardless.

just my 2 cents.

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i’m sorry to disagree, but i don’t personally thing that you should compare two different games.
one it’s a game mady by AAA, and the other one, from a much smaller team. second of all, thank to god, enlisted is not made to be competitive unlike r6.

saying this,
you brought many points, which some are good, and others… not so much.
don’t get me wrong,
i do respect your idea, but i don’t think you considered a couple of things and i would like to share my opinion about this.

i presume that you want a season pass with unique units and unique content, right?

but here i have to ask you;

than, what’s the point of having premium squads?

if you implement a season pass,
i don’t think you would have much content to do this idea. as you can see, enlisted it has been designed to cover some known battles, not entire fronts.

meaning that there weren’t and there arent many divisions to be added. yes, there are some other variants that could be added, and i presume, those are the first idea of why premium squads exist.

but i dislike this idea of having a battlepass overhall.
because, why if i want to enjoy and play a game, i have to be forced to play over and over just to get that content that i wouldn’t be able to have it otherwise?. not to mention, the ammount of content that new players will miss or the content that i never be able to use if i don’t grind on that period time.

here’s the point, i don’t think i have much time to do so.
i usually work 7 hours every day, ( recently, less due to covid ) but, the point is, i enjoy enlisted. and after some matches that took me over 3 months, i’m at level 10. which it’s not much. but i don’t have enough time to play this game if a battle pass will be implemented.

very debatable.
enlisted unlike many others game, as i said, it’s not meant to be competitive. an i dislike this " meta " because it’s not fuctional at all. this is why enlisted unlike many others games, it gives you the opportunity to decide what to use ( once you unlocked it ) what to bring, and what no.
so i disagree by removing or even change current squads. that’s they reason why they are special.

i mean, a new system that would rewamp the whole divisions purpouse could be done, but i’m not sure how much effective would be.

so if you wanna limit enginners and gives each classe a role with each structures, it’s not a bad idea either. but it would require too much work. and i’m not sure the devs are into that right now.

no, nein, nyet.
you are literally making this game a pay to win.

i strongly disagree with those " premium Squads " because it would just break compleatly the balance of the game, make it too much one sided. like, " win who pays more ".

i don’t think you have thought about the huge backdrawes coming from those squads.

again, why would you limit stuff and make this game a nightmare for new people that are interestred in the game? you are just gonna destroy them.

with this whole i post i do see that you are trying to find new economic way to financial this support, and i do respect that, but as i always said, i think it’s the best this game make money on cosmetics, rather than equipment. or many people will avoid this game and dies on it’s own.

you can already see that many people are driven away by the premium squads. you are just throwing more gasoline on the fire.

but this is just my idea.

Cheers ^^

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I’d like to propose customization to be part of premium squads:
Give them weapon reskin (for example, a birch wood stock on a kar98k instead of pine/oak/whatever they use rn) that you can apply on any instance of that weapon / on any weapon that it could be applied on.
Give them uniform reskins that can be applied on any soldier of that class or on any soldier in that squad
Maybe even give them unique voice lines?
Also allow them to level up the squad they represent. For example, let the premium assaulter squad level up the normal assaulter squad, but at +100% XP rate. Also let premium squads give +100% XP to the soldiers in their squad

Do not however, give them unique, fully upgraded weapons and full perks like rn.
I would be fine with the soldiers being 3-4 stars and unleveled, but 5 is too much of an advantage.

A good fix for the unique guns would be to have events where you can unlock the blueprint for that weapon so you can obtain it.

Well you can’t really argue that for most situations and most maps the double assaulter, single gunner squad setup is going to net you the most kills and will allow you to cap the most points

  • engineers would be better if you are always on defense, but you are not
  • snipers cant cap points well
  • AT squads cant cap points well and sometimes there simply are no enemy tanks and even if there are, explosive packs generally get the job done better / more quickly
  • etc

Sure you might not enjoy the playstyle, but that does not mean that objectively speaking, the average player will get better results with it.

in principle it wouldnt be too much work, if the build system is not spaghetti code.
when opening the build menu, have the game check what squad your engineer is in
if not engineer, get what special building corresponds to the squad your engineer is in and make that one available, locking the other ones.

In principle they would be fine if they either were just reskins, or allowed for a slightly diffrent playstyle. For example, let’s say you had a rifleman squad being able to build the respawn point, instead of the MG nest as proposed above. Or a sniper squad that would have a radioman instead of a assaulter as backup. Minor tweaks that wouldn’t impact gameplay too much (arguably still P2W but less so than 7x assaulters at least)

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This game truly not a sport and i like this way, so all you say make sence.
Personally prefer to use rifle man with almost nothing - its challenging and smart gameplay. But then i play with my team we need to make as much damage as we can and support each other. So in this way i use stormtroopers and lmg.

Premium squads doesnt need to be op - its got to be interesting and have uniqe tactics. R6 new operators often op but EVERYTIME they interesting. That`s the main idea - give something you can use for interteiment not only cheesy gameplay and many frags. For example Spec ops pio for Germans can have little mine-tanks Sonder Kraftfahrzeug “Goliath”. U cant kill a lot but it would be such a trick…

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No, just no. Mines are terrible to play against as they are even harder to counter than mortars.

Premium squads should never offer options that normal squads can not offer. That is P2W.

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Can’t disagree. as this is what we basically have been said from the beginning.

exept, i do. because i don’t have any assaulters in the first place.
aside from my main offencive squad (which even there), i only have one assaulter.
on the other i prefer make my troop of other classes advance, so i can turn them in more stars. because it’s preatty much the main point of enlisted,
having the ability to chose. preference of the player. assaulters might be good, but i rather use a vz rifle or a gw 30/40. due to my play style.

and for no reason it the world i wanna be forced to do something just for the meta or just becouse it helps more other people.

and i don’t think this should be changed in favor of more powerfull roles for having almost an unbeatable squad.
that’s why i said that having the variety it’s good. at the same time enlisted put you in the situation that you have to adapt. not always be an ever " green " on the battlefield.

tactics should make the difference based on what you have.

well, i don’t know much about that. but what i meant, is that, i don’t know how much covenient would be change the entire system of squads. in my opinion, the current one it’s more than good.

i could thank others, but it’s not said that they do works.

exept, yet again, they do.

because you are moving elements unique of a squads, to another.
and i’m quite sure that they do impact the gameplay.

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As I said, for the average player. You are not the average player.

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There is no such a big difference in hitbox in a winter maps -Screenshot_27

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The meta gameplay sort of fails after you finish campaign. Which is not that hard if you do take the meta route. After you finish campaign, there is not a lot to play for in the game. The only reason to continue with a faction is to upgrade your squads and max them out.
I personally don’t take the meta route because I like to get squads upgrades alongside winning. Winning is secondary for me as long as I can get EXP for my squads. Not sure if that makes me ‘not an average player’ but imo that should be the route players should be taking. Other than that, Enlisted is boring af. Same thing over and over again with nothing to show for in the end.
This is one of the failures of Enlisted. It won’t be able to retain its player base over a longer period of time. Any attempt to do this will likely lead to the game becoming a P2W or having massive balancing issues, as seen with the recent updates.

Addressing the original topic itself, the whole idea is extremely narrow minded. The author does not take into consideration the F2P players who will be the larger majority once the game releases. They can’t take 3 automatic weapons squad. Therefore it is important that they have a good shot at defending against the said type of players.
Limiting engineer builds take this away from F2P players. And it also makes it even harder for new players to have a chance at progressing early in the game as engineer builds from the higher level players helps them in various ways to defend and attack.
As for the premium medic squad, I don’t really see a need for it unless you remove the medkits too. In that case, well good luck getting this game anywhere.
As Cat said above, I am sure you have good intentions when suggesting more buyable squads or a restriction system. But I read the whole the whole topic and all I see is someone who does not have a reason to appreciate the rest of the soldier class in the game as they have a premium squads and can fill the rest of the slots with meta squads. I don’t blame you for it, that’s just how bad this game has got since the introduction of premium squads.

I look at Enlisted now and see a prime example of failing game solely due to developer decisions. The game is fun when you start. Good looking, loads of action, fast paced but once you are past that ‘everything new’ phase, then you realise the core issues of this game. Honestly, I hope this game goes south now so that the devs realise how not to make money off of a game and hopefully fix it because listening does not seem to be something they are very good at.

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I’d argue that the proposed MG nest for the rifleman squad is the building they need the most, so they dont really lose out there. Furthermore, it hurts experienced players more as they are more likely to have and use engineers in other squads.

If the AI actually perform properly and they remove the random progression and reintroduce the more skill-based gameplay, I can see myself play this game for a long time.

Mind you that progression is not needed to keep playing a game. In TF2 generally your best weapons are the starter weapons, and the unlocks that are better can be obtained within a week. Yet the game is still going strong over 10 years after its release.

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TF 2 is rolling in many features. One of them - Uniqe skills of characters. So making squads one and only - best way to obtain this great expiriense

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There are no character skills in TF2, you must be thinking of overwatch.

TF2 only has a handful of usable weapons per class, most of them being single shot, high damage weapons that highly reward accuracy, yet also provides the needed movement tech to counter even slightly misplaced attacks. The skill floor is low enough for anyone to pick up the game, but the ceiling is high enough to warrant hundreds of hours to learn everything.

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This is exactly what I`m talking about. They also got different hitbox, amount of health, buildings, etc

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Зачем вы второй раз написали одну и ту же тему, только уже для англоязычной части форума? Комьюнити менеджеры отлично прочтут это в оригинале, в русскоязычном разделе.

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Clothing isn’t part of your hitbox believe it or not. I find myself accidentally sniping through trenchcoats without hitting on occasion.

But I’m definitely against anything that changes hitboxes.

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I`m glad you like the idea of specialization of engineers. We discuss a lot female characters so let’s leave it for now. Al in all developers will choose the way - to be or not to be. Season pass not necessary but I feel now we all make a hard free way to build whole squads. Remember - this is a Gaijin game - I’m sure - there will be a lot way to speed up your grind, upgrade your gear and many, many more founding ways.

I`m sure it will be not only customization - skins, colors, camouflage etc.

Now we testing clear path to upgrade all without any boost. And it feels no slow, no fast. Most time I play rifle squads and indeed I suffer a lot of MP and mg squads. They are still very strong cause you ought to get close to enemy while took points. There is still one of the biggest questions - there is a place of bolt rifle squads? We have Tannenberg and Verdun games - perfect example of 9/10 bolt rifles on the field. I try to play it again just to figure out how to deal with this disadvantage. In other hand we have BF1. Now I have 21 level and have gear up almost 7 squads. I don’t need to merge ammunitions.

Don’t know but maybe we need to calculate times you earn supplies card. One card - one chance to earn some frags, med kits etc. And while you level up you got lots of them. Surely you will gear up 3 squads fully at least. I told in another tread - maybe the solution of health perk issue could be choice - you can have +20 damage OR +35% health. It’s truly rpg way - to be tank or a knight. I like it.

And as an indie developer you talk about mathematics of grind. I tell you like a player, a tester who play a lot. So there is 2 different points of view. I think its ok.

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That’s why I would like to see a rework so perks and weapon upgrades become sidegrades
20% more damage, but lower rate of fire, visualized through a heavy bolt for your gun.
30% more health, but less ammo and stamina, thanks to body armor, etc.