I know.
Probably the translator ate the word.
I meant that this is a positive difference rather than a negative one.
1 Like
My source is Red Orchestra 2
I see a strange interpretation of the situation. Game developers have pointed out that if a weapon is period correct, it can appear in the game. (if you need a source for this statement, find yourself in some of the older news). Enlisted game is an interpretation of Historical accuracy, between arcade and simulation. You’ve already been told by most of the people here how various experimental weapons and vehicles are being introduced in other campaigns. If you don’t play them, it’s your choice. But that’s the structure of this game, and that “Historical accuracy truth” has long been broken, because that’s the principle of this game.
I’ve reviewed the books I have:
1.- Peter Senich “Deutsche Sturmgewehre bis 1945”
2.- AJ Barker “German infantry weapons of World War 2”
3.- Nemecke rucni zbrane 2. Svetove Valky (Slovak book)
4.- Rough Forged (history and collector’s guide to German Self-Loading rifles of WWII
5.- Стрелковое оружие вчера: Лидшун Р., Воллерт Г.
6.- Стрелковое оружие Второй Мировой. Коллекционное издание
7.- “Sturmgerwehr” by Hans Dieter Handrich
No book specifically mentions the use of the MKb weapon specifically in Stalingrad. However, it is made clear that both the MKb-42 (H) and the Walter variant of the MKb-42 (W) were tested under real military conditions on the Eastern Front. That is an indisputable fact. We will not know how much and under what conditions these weapons were used before the end of 1942, but I think it is logical to assume that in any case, it is entirely possible that these weapons (namely the MKb-42h) could have traveled to Stalingrad in one way or another. This is evidenced by the findings in those regions.
7 Likes
Well said. Furthermore i’d like to pay respect and wish luck for your personal historic research.
I’ve already said I wouldn’t mind it if MKb was a gold order weapon or a premium squad of 4 “experimenting” soldiers, or if Germany suffered so much in terms of equipment, they desperately needed something powerful to counter the USSR.
But as of today most players report having ~50% winrate for Sovies and close to ~99% for Germans, and the fact that Germany gets the best gun in the game (which isn’t confirmed to have been at Stalingrad at all) which can be used by both assaults and engineers (2-4 squads, i.e. infitite rotation), just leaves me scratching my head as to why was this weapon needed in this campaign.
If it was defintely there - sure, if it was just another gun - sure, but undocumented and best in the game… I don’t know about that.
PS
I do appreciate your historical enthusiasm though, game matters aside, according to Ian McCollum, production of MKb-42 (H) started in early 1943, others assign first production batches to late 1942, in either case the Germans were encircled in Stalingrad in November.
In your (unbiased) opinion, how likely it is that the weapon could reach the encircled and struggling troops at Stalingrad?
As I was able to find any information, only one took action under the Moscow among three of them.
Almost all were at Leningrad.
Enlisted claims to be historically accurate however it doesn’t seem too be 
Also just realized the m2 carbine shouldn’t be in Normandy due to it being produced in 1945 >w>
My interpretation could be as follows:
After German forces managed to break through the “Kholm Pocket” in May 5, 1942, MKb weapons (the ones that still remained in the hands of surviving German troops, after being airdropped there) merged into overall German military forces. And, continuing the Eastern Front campaign, these weapons continued to be used until August 1942 (when the Stalingrad offensive began), falling into those circumstances as well, way before all the the events that started after then soviets launched Operation Uranus (November 19), that encircle the entire 6th Army.
So now try to deny that such a logical sequence of events is not possible.
I don’t know why you’re antagonizing me when I ask you a genuine question.
Well then,
a) any documented source on MKbs airdropped to Kholm pocket? (also really high risk of Soviets capturing the latest technology);
b) you know Kholm is near Leningrad, that’s about 1700km away from Stalingrad, what are the chances of a soldier making that journey with a prototype weapon and prototype ammo, and not being captured and immediately studied by the Soviets in February 1943?
This information spread from the book “Sturmgewehr! From Firepower to Striking Power” by Hans-Dieter Handrich. So you will need to contact the author of this book and ask him in person. Yes, it is also true that there are many topics from other experts who deny this fact. However, as I wrote to you after reviewing the books in my collection, the initial testing of this weapon took place on the eastern front until the end of 1942 (hence the numbers “42”). As a result, the MKb-42 (W) variant was rejected, resulting in the MP-43/1 because without the first tests in 1942, the weapon would not have evolved in 1943. Even if it didn’t happen to Kholm Pocket specifically, it did happen in the Eastern Front campaign anyway. So - my theory here, still stands.
You know that the whole “Operation Barbarossa” has covered almost 3,000km, and that there is such a thing as military logistics?
According to “Forgotten Weapons” experts, the first of these weapons was taken over only in 1943. Here is a quote:
Some Russian sources claim that the first MkB were captured back in March 1943. However, this information has yet to be confirmed by any documents. Conducting my own research in the Central Archive of Russian MOD (known as TsAMO), I found a report dated June 1943 (source: fund 81, case file 87, “Correspondence on foreign small arms”), which allows us to re-establish the timeline of capturing the first Maschinenkarabiner 42. It reads as follows:
“To the Head of GAU KA (Main artillery directorate of Red Army). I am sending lieutenant-technician N.N. Troitsky to deliver a German automatic carbine and 4 cartridges for it, which were captured at the 22nd Army’s sector near the city of Holm in June”.
It can be one way, it can be another. Just like mine just like yours. The fact is that the weapon was tested on the Eastern Front until the end of 1942. That is the main fact. So this is perfectly sufficient for all these interpretations of “that exceptional soldier” or unit who traveled with the prototype all the way to Stalingrad.
End of the debate.
Screw you wholeheartedly, I will debate as much as I want.
No one is denying that it was sent to the Eastern Front, however this is not a theory of yours, but unsubstantiated speculation.
I know it most likely better than you do, because I actually live here.
How cute of you to think I haven’t read that already. Russian capture sources talk about March-June, but nothing of Stalingrad and nothing of late 1942.
Historical case of Stalingrad is hereby closed since you presented zero evidence.
It could have been there, just like anywhere else on the Eastern Front, but there is not a single evidence it ever did.
So, chew these facts, and don’t start raising a childish voice because your arguments become weak.
?? you just signed off your own statement of zero evidence. I was trying to have a civilized historical discussion, but you acted all jerky from the start. Go away now, be snobish elsewhere.
You’re just a troll who, while getting info, still barks like a dog when a caravan passes through it. If you’re a stubborn and believer in your beliefs, then go read more books, or will you say “give me the source again?
Read through your replies and see who acts like an asshole
Even books won’t help you become a decent person, it seems. Go away to snob jail now.
Because the Fedorov is in Berlin, where it makes even less sense.
I sacrificed my time to gather facts that in no way deny the possibility of MKb going to Stalingrad. I actually gave you the source materials and other info as it was possible, but when you really got the decent material for further discussion, you just started to get angry first because you didn’t have a way to retaliate. So here you have it.
I have been interested in the German WW2 military for almost 20 years. I also collect WW2 German militaria. Naturally, it intrigued me. I don’t want to repeat myself, but man, if your beliefs don’t allow you to play this computer game, it’s just your own business. No offense now for real.
And by the way, if it seemed to you that my answers were offensive to you, it was just your interpretation, because it was just the manner of my expression.
1 Like
I literally said “games aside”, what’s your opinion? - like in a decent conversation, and you go all aggressive “now try to deny these facts”.
If that’s a language barrier then peace be with you.