From my experience and that of most players that I have talked to, defense games end in a loss far more often than a win. Approximately 75-85% of the time IF playing against actual players. There are plenty of reasons this is the case. The most notable being:
Fortifications are inherently weak against not just vehicles, but often against infantry as well.
Attackers are allowed to not just flank the objective, but even get in behind and completely cut defenders off.
In invasion mode (which is most prevalent) attackers don’t lose progress from the objective when completely pushed off.
Defenders ultimately are forced to stay within the objective to have a chance of holding the attackers off.
My Suggestions are first and foremost related to fortifications:
Sandbags need to be IMMUNE to grenade damage.
–My reasoning is that it requires a specific character type (engineers) an amount of time while right next to it to put them up. They should not be able to be destroyed by an item that all classes can carry (up to 3 of) and can be thrown at a distance.
–TNT is available to all characters, in all campaigns, and does not even require squad upgrades to use. However, you do have to push up point blank to use it.
–Engineers or characters carrying “tool” consumables should be the only ones capable of deconstructing them.
–Aircraft bombs and tanks running over them should still be able to clear them.
In addition, sandbag walls should be allowed to be stacked 2 high in ALL locations. This allows for more solid fortification and the ability to restrict passageways as needed.
Czech Hedehogs should only be able to be “deconstructed” by engineers. They can still be cleared using TNT and aircraft bombs. However, they should not be able to be removed by tank crews especially, as that is what they are designed specifically to stop.
– No longer allow them to be placed indoors.
Barbwire should follow similar rules to sandbags. Cannot be deconstructed by just any character, requires an engineer or TNT to clear. Tanks can drive through and clear with ease.
Standard MG nests are given an updated model that includes a sandbag window in the upper section of the structure. This makes it more viable in comparison to the HMG nest.
With these changes, teamwork will be incentivized even further, defense teams will have a higher success chance, TNT will have an established purpose, and tanks will become more important as push related tools rather than greyzone campers. In addition, it would push players to use more smoke grenades, smoke shells, smoke mortars, and smoke artillery in order to push objectives.
*If you don’t have something constructive to add, please don’t clog up the replies with nonsense and complaining.
people say that engineer is S-tier class and if not for rally points no fckn way he would be that high.
i believe this is the only thing I’m not agreed with you, i mean the bombing, Chech hedgehogs are solid piece of steel aint sure if bombing should affect them much.
and also we could use barbwire cutter maybe
and last thing i want to mention is that maybe let us queue stuff to build for ours engineer’s. The thing nobody talk about is time to place thing to build down which often can take more than building itself. Placing barbwire indoors while people running around the obiective can be mad difficult.
The only problem I have with your suggestions is that attackers have a ticket count. Defenders do not. So with these suggestions defenders can now practically build impenetrable defense line that the attackers would have to bleed more tickets to attack. There needs to be some give here.
You have to remember players/humans are dumb. They will not spawn engineer to tear down obstacles.
good point, hard to disagree, there’s gotta be a solution though, otherwise building fortifications is pointless, countless times I’ve been working on defense for so long only to be destroyed in matters of seconds.
But on the other hand if attackers don’t attack it doesn’t matter how strong defensive is. It’s skill issue, attackers don’t understand what they’re suppose to do or refuse to do so. What I mean is try to defend a good rushing team, there is no chance, they might as well rush with little shooting and still you would struggle to defend the point
Compromise I’ve been thinking of is two-stage lifespan of a sandbag, where if naded it would be destroyed crouch-height. Same for barbwire or make it so it wouldn’t slow you down this much and maybe so it wouldn’t hurt you? i dunno but i feel like there’s gotta do something.
The proposed changes would make it super easy to just block attackers from the cap by spamming engineer constructions.
Defenders ultimately are forced to stay within the objective to have a chance of holding the attackers off.
Yeah, sounds a bit like defending a point.
100% of defense issues boil down to the team doing random shit and not focusing on the simple fact: you have unlimited amount tickets and the only thing you need to do is have more troopers on the cap than the enemy. Defense loses if 80% of the team are morons who camp 10m away from the cap point.
I have played some matches (not many) where defenders spam fortifications on points. Reich chancellery in Berlin campaign comes to mind. I see good players putting tank traps at doors to hamper attackers ability to get inside. Usually it’s no problem, but sometimes my idiots team can bleed a lot of tickets trying to take that 1 point, which in return don’t have enough to finish the points that are left.
Have you ever played normandy lol? i guess not, because you wouldn’t post such made up nonsense. I guess you just suffer on skill issues. Win defense is probably the easiest thing in this game, you dont even have to support form your team. Winning defense with bad team mates is far easier than win attack with bad team mates.
Let defenders have their own tickets first before talking about making fortifications stronger so we could even do positional battles where we could just bombard the cap point till one of the sides run out of tickets.
People might be dumb, but they are not so dumb that they get stuck running against walls or invisible barriers. I sincerely hope you are not saying that the A.I. in this game is more intelligent than human players… because that is not true. I literally watch the A.I. get stuck ALL THE TIME.
In fact, yes, I know the map and I know where to attack, it’s really difficult, but not impossible since it requires a lot of coordination and knowing where the hell to put explosives to knock down walls and where to place spawn points, but leaving the point of defense ,i agree to add a tool to cut the wires,add a last life to the other defenses and heck,add other possible defenses
This is how it CURRENTLY works. I agree with you that bombs shouldn’t take them out (unless perhaps direct hit). I left this part only so that less resistance to the post would be present since so many people think they are OP.
I put it in another post, but I think that “Tools” consumable that is currently only used for tank repairs should be required to break down things like barbwire or even sandbags. It would potentially help fix the grenade spam too.
You can put down the ghost of a fortification and then order engineers in your squad to build them already. This is where engineer squads are really quite useful.
Attackers have a ticket count, yes, however, they are given a lot more freedom in how they move around as they don’t have to babysit a base. In addition, the attackers make permanent progress on the objective. Something defenders can’t work around.
The suggested upgrades would help attackers too, you just have to have a mindset for it. Sandbagging trenches would make it easier to push up on an objective for example.
The main thing you have to remember is that if defenders had tickets, the offense wouldn’t have to worry about the objective as much, they would just bleed the defenders of their tickets. The offense is already at the advantage because of what I mentioned above. Defender tickets would make things worse.
I will note however, that if my suggestions were implemented, and issues were still arising, I wouldn’t be opposed to additional changes like you were saying. It needs to be tested before its called OP.
If you tell an engineer to work on a fortification, they will work on it until it is done. If you are also hammering on that structure, the build speed stacks.
I have in fact played a lot of Normandy. If your point is that some maps as Axis specifically are easy to defend, I would agree. Those maps fall into the 15-25% of the time in which defense is actually possible. Why? Because the built in fortifications that CANNOT be destroyed no matter what you do are extremely strong. In addition, there are choke points around the Ally tank spawns that can be dug out and made impassible.
Majority of maps do not have this level of built-in defenses. Making the stronger fortifications more important. In addition, I actually think the changes I suggested may make Offense on those specific maps more viable. As sandbags would allow attackers more safety with which to move up the beaches.
Yes it would increase defenders capabilities some, but engineering TOO MUCH is also a possibility that most people don’t currently consider as it is extremely rarely an issue in the current state.
Thats why I use a full 6-engineer squad to place the blueprint and have the boys build them for me.
Barbed wire is honestly a high IQ placement to get right. You need to know where the enemy tends to move within the map while also having them far enough away to prevent them from hurting your own team. On certain maps they can be really good tho
