Mega suggestion for better Allies MGs in BR III - V

[Phitaya]

M1918A2: easy recoil control fast move and fast reload. It a good gun in BR 3-5
Johnson MG: is bad choice in BR4
M1919A6: this a good gun with easy recoil control with 100 round
USA problem is not have good MG on BR2 and BR4

[robihr]

@sku111

The Allies are just not competitive, at least in MGs, against the Germans.

lol. saying that after stinger. also m1919a6 is great MG that i prefer over mg42 100.

@sku111

but I have included screenshots for you to view if you so want.

at least include screenshots from euthys table. people dont have time to go over fake stats.

@sku111

Among the most notable is that the MG 13 has exactly the same spec as the BAR (and KE7), if not better and is only a BR II MG. This proves that at least one, if not all, BARs and the KE7, should be downtiered.

Also evident is the gap between the MG 34/42 and the BAR/Johnson LMG. The two Allied MGs shoot “comparable” RPM to the Axis counterparts, however, are down 30 rounds. I have a few suggestions on how this can be fixed (I will get to the MG 81 later down).

BAR A2 has much better horizontal recoil and smaller sprinting penalty(75% vs 50% of mg13). also it has better moving spread increase. problem is that you think that BAR is MG and not BR3 AR.

also johnson is trash on BR4 and it needs to be at least downtiered to BR3.

@sku111

ntroduce a 40 round BAR

These were real MGs fielded by the United States Army during WWII. They were field modifications (like most flamethrowers on tanks), where they simply just welded an extra BAR magazine onto an existing one. I don’t know why they didn’t come out of the factory like this, but point is, it would make a perfect BR III MG for the Allies. That way, the BAR M1918A2 will fire 600rpm and have a 40 round magazine.

BAR with 40 rounds seems little OP on BR3. BAR with 20 rounds is pretty powerful if you know how to use it.

@sku111

Introduce a 50 round M1919 .30 cal

This one is really simple. Just copy the M1919A6, and just make it a 50 round belt fed variant instead, just like the MG 34 and 42 are for the Germans. I’m unsure whether any were made in WWII (I think the smallest was 100 rounds, with most being 250 rounds), however, 50 round belts are made for replicas, so yeah…

i like the idea of 50 round m1919a6 for BR4. i know that soldiers used starter belts in vietnam war with size of ~20-25 rounds when they were on move and later clipped longer belt when they were stationary. however idk if that was a thing in ww2 nor if they had 50 round belts.

@sku111

MG 81 (basically a Axis tech tree stinger).

not even close.
stinger:

• 200 rounds
• 1190 rpm
• recoil per bullet 6V, 13H
• dispersion 0.34
• less moving spread increase

mg 81

• 100 rounds
• 1760 rom
• recoil per bullet 21V, 14H
• dispersion 0.47

@sku111

Yes, I understand the MG 81 is useless, but the fact is it’s still a stinger. So, my suggestion is purely that. Add the Stinger to the tech tree. But, a worser version.

The perfect BR V MG for the Allies would be a Stinger, but with a 100 round belt.

f*** no. what they should do is fix actual event stinger to have 100 round magazine like it actually had.

@Dregomz

Obviously Americans should get something better as right now M1919 are just not that great and can’t even compete vs STG44 at mid range and vs MG42 100 it instantly loses,

i prefer m1919a6 over mg42 100. it has control and accuracy over it. certainly it loses in CQC, but it is a beast in mid range.

@Jade Stern

Yes, one of the best machine guns in BR2 is still not usable for you. I really doubt your skills.

best amongst trash is still trash. SMG are meta on most BR with a reason and not MG.

@Jade Stern

as the advantages of MG13 and ZB26 are meant to balance the disadvantages of German submachine guns,

good joke

@Jade Stern

but some people refuse to use them for various reasons.

cause they are trash? they have 3x vertical and 10x horizontal recoil of SMG and movement penalty of 50%.

[Jade_Stern]

@robihr

cause they are trash? they have 3x vertical and 10x horizontal recoil of SMG and movement penalty of 50%.

Your machine gun has a high enough firing rate in the BR2, which completely means that you are strongest at close range. For long distances, do you think the BR2 submachine gun can suppress the machine gun? Don’t be funny anymore, it’s just that your poor skills only allow you to use low recoil weapons.

Don’t make me mention using other weapons when sprinting again. Do you use it to sprint when playing Stinger?The M1916A6 has a worse sprint speed, I don’t understand why you like it.
Additionally, their recoil is mainly vertical and not that high, which is still difficult for you?

As the topic continues, there are always some guys who expose their low skills.

[sku111]

@robihr

saying that after stinger

I came post merge, when it released the second time on Steam. I don’t have the Stinger, nor does most of the playerbase, so my statement is correct. I’m glad you prefer the .30 cal, but extra choice doesn’t hurt.

@robihr

people dont have time to go over fake stats

I’m still relatively new (soon will be 1 year since I started playing), so I will sometimes forget that the spreadsheet exists. It’s not like it’s in plain sight whenever I open up the forum. Also, do I see you outside with a dyno testing the power output of your car because “the manufacturers specs may be wrong”? I just go with the stats that are given because I trust that they are correct (I have no idea how to access game files, and who’s to say if Euthy is wrong or not).

@robihr

problem is that you think that BAR is MG and not BR3 AR

Point I’m getting at. From BR II to BR V, Allies don’t actually have a gun worth calling an MG, just a glorified assault rifle (with worser specs). My suggestion would fix this, by giving us more choice. Besides, I use the M1928A1 Thompson instead; far more reliable at room clearing.

@robihr

BAR with 40 rounds seems little OP on BR3

No, it’s balanced. Everyone has just gotten used to one sidedness in this game. Soviets have the DP-27 at BR III (47 rounds, 550 rpm), the Germans have the MG 34 (50 rounds, 800rpm) and the Japanese have the Type 99 LMG (30 rounds, 800rpm). A BAR with 40 rounds and 600rpm fits right in-between them.

[robihr]

@Jade Stern

Your machine gun has a high enough firing rate in the BR2, which completely means that you are strongest at close range. For long distances, do you think the BR2 submachine gun can suppress the machine gun? Don’t be funny anymore, it’s just that your poor skills only allow you to use low recoil weapons.

then you dont mind drastically increasing recoil for SMG? how would you like if pps 42 and 43 got 3x vertical and 10x horizontal recoil increase, alongside with random horizontal direction of recoil(aka recoil dir 0). then when people complain about them being shitty weapon, german mains will just say that soviets have skill issue. there is reason why SMG are meta for all BR and not MG.

@Jade Stern

Don’t make me mention using other weapons when sprinting again. Do you use it to sprint when playing Stinger?The M1916A6 has a worse sprint speed, I don’t understand why you like it.

you said it was meant to be compensation for shitty german SMG. i dont have problem with sprinting speed when comparing apples to apples. but if you are comparing MG to SMG, then sprinting speed is a big factor.

@Jade Stern

As the topic continues, there are always some guys who expose their low skills.

usually soviet mains who dont know how game works…

@sku111

I came post merge, when it released the second time on Steam. I don’t have the Stinger, nor does most of the playerbase, so my statement is correct. I’m glad you prefer the .30 cal, but extra choice doesn’t hurt.

stinger is currently broken cause it has 200 rounds in 100 round box. it is by far best MG in game cause it has best handling(amongst classic MG, not including rd44 here) and bonus of 200 rounds. it would be nice if new players can somehow earn it (besides spending tens of millions of silver on rng box), but i think that it shouldnt be TT weapon.

btw you mixed the event for stinger for like a week or two.

@sku111

It’s not like it’s in plain sight whenever I open up the forum.

forgot that you were new to the forum, so my bad. honestly it kinda irks me that devs dont have real stats in game written plainly, so when i see forum users use those i lash out on wrong people…

@sku111

(I have no idea how to access game files, and who’s to say if Euthy is wrong or not).

most of it was made available from game editor and game files, so it is relatively easy to check for those who want to.

@sku111

No, it’s balanced. Everyone has just gotten used to one sidedness in this game. Soviets have the DP-27 at BR III (47 rounds, 550 rpm), the Germans have the MG 34 (50 rounds, 800rpm) and the Japanese have the Type 99 LMG (30 rounds, 800rpm). A BAR with 40 rounds and 600rpm fits right in-between them.

like i said BAR plays more like an AR. giving it 40 rounds would make it powerful. it would be better to find some MG from US/UK/france/belgium that would fit in BR3 with ~50 rounds as alternative.

[sku111]

The lewis would have been the perfect candidate, had it not been instantly made a premium. It by all rights should have been tech tree, considering its prominence during the war.

[Jade_Stern]

@robihr

then you dont mind drastically increasing recoil for SMG?

If they have damage of 10 points or higher, I really don’t mind.

@robihr

but if you are comparing MG to SMG, then sprinting speed is a big factor.

Similarly, the damage of machine guns cannot be compared to SMG, and you have no reason to say that machine guns are worse.

I still want to remind you that in terms of recoil alone, MG-13 and ZB26 are not much worse than FG-42.I still want to remind you that in terms of recoil alone, MG-13 and ZB26 are not much worse than FG-42.

@robihr

there is reason why SMG are meta for all BR and not MG.

How about trying SMG on BR5?Machine guns, like SMGs, are important weapons in BR2-BR3 because we don’t have fully automatic rifles, but it’s different in BR5.

"SMG is meta"is just your subjective idea, so you will refuse to use MG34 even if it is already quite excellent.You won’t understand the advantage of a high-speed machine gun in the BR2 either.

@robihr

usually soviet mains who dont know how game works…

A noob that doesn’t even know how to use machine guns.

[CapitalLen]

From my personal experience after they nerfed the MGs’ moving dispersions the BAR absolutely does not play like an AR. Even though it has slightly less aimed dispersion while moving it’s still very poor especially when combined with its low magazine capacity. At least the MG-34 can compensate by being an absolute buzzsaw at close range.

[GeneralBrus]

@Phitaya

USA problem is not have good MG on BR2 and BR4

Hear me out - and dont freak out pls:

What if one of the BARs would be a BR4 trooper weapon?
It still has MG penalties - which makes sense since it is quite heavy.

[Greyparrots]

Nice job on counting on those numbers there because for some reason a good majority of the people do not understand that.

[robihr]

@Jade Stern

If they have damage of 10 points or higher, I really don’t mind.

Handheld Machine Guns			Damage				Reload Timings (s)			Statcard Recoil			Actual Recoil			Moving Spread Increase
Weapon Name	Obtained	BR	10m	100m	Velocity	Magazine	Reload	Alt Reload	Rate of Fire	Vertical	Horizontal	Recoil Control	Vertical	Horizontal	Dispersion	While Aiming	Hipfiring
Madsen	32000 RP	II	13.2	11.9	815	25 (+1)	2.7	2.0	500	39	21	0.9	35	19	0.33	14.0	35.0
MG 13	34000 RP	II	13.2	11.9	750	25 (+1)	2.6	2.0	660	28	20	0.9	25	18	0.32	17.0	45.0

then use madsen… it only has slightly higher recoil than mg13… or are you not skilled enough for it?

@Jade Stern

Similarly, the damage of machine guns cannot be compared to SMG, and you have no reason to say that machine guns are worse.

then play MG on low BR. idk why everyone is using SMG if they are not worse…

@Jade Stern

I still want to remind you that in terms of recoil alone, MG-13 and ZB26 are not much worse than FG-42.I still want to remind you that in terms of recoil alone, MG-13 and ZB26 are not much worse than FG-42.

lol…

1. horizontal recoil matters. MG have more than double horizontal recoil of fg42
2. recoil direction matters. MG have random horizontal recoil direction that makes it unpredictable. fg42 has predictable right leaning recoil.

@Jade Stern

How about trying SMG on BR5?Machine guns, like SMGs, are important weapons in BR2-BR3 because we don’t have fully automatic rifles, but it’s different in BR5.

"SMG is meta"is just your subjective idea, so you will refuse to use MG34 even if it is already quite excellent.You won’t understand the advantage of a high-speed machine gun in the BR2 either.

smg are meta on all BR except on BR5. on BR5 meta is SF rifles and AR.

i will usually not use MG cause downsides are more then upsides. usually it needs 2 bullets to down, it has sprint penalty and has shit horizontal recoil regardless of BR(exception of rd44 which is AR masquerading as MG). they are excellent when you can bipod them somewhere, but otherwise there are much better guns.
btw what is high speed MG exactly for you? mg 13 with 660rpm? or zb26 with 830rpm? also higher ROF=higher recoil. i would take pps43 over those 2 any time of day.

@Jade Stern

A noob that doesn’t even know how to use machine guns.

cool story. why are you not using them on all BR then? or is that something only reserved for people you assume are german mains?

[Jade_Stern]

@robihr

horizontal recoil matters. MG have more than double horizontal recoil of fg42

Why don’t you go to the training ground and try it out, and then tell me whose level has better recoil.I can’t imagine how much of your data is outdated.

[robihr]

@Jade Stern

Why don’t you go to the training ground and try it out, and then tell me whose level has better recoil.I can’t imagine how much of your data is outdated.

maybe check here: Enlisted Resource - Google Spreadsheets

Weapon Name	Obtained	BR	10m	100m	Velocity	Magazine	Reload	Alt Reload	Rate of Fire	Vertical	Horizontal	Recoil Control	Vertical	Horizontal	Dispersion	While Aiming	Hipfiring	Visual Recoil	Recoil Dir
FG 42	122000 RP	V	15.3	12.5	750	20 (+1)	2.6	2.2	990	75	32	0.25	19	8	0.25	0.0	23.0	0.3	0.35
FG 42 II	126000 RP	V	15.3	12.5	750	20 (+1)	2.6	2.2	830	67	22	0.25	17	6	0.22	0.0	23.0	0.3	0.35
MG 13	34000 RP	II	13.2	11.9	750	25 (+1)	2.6	2.0	660	28	20	0.9	25	18	0.32	17.0	45.0	0.8	0.0
ZB-26	48000 RP	II	13.2	11.9	750	20	2.7	2.1	830	35	20	0.9	32	18	0.31	12.0	30.0	0.4	0.0

[Admiral_Wenli]

Saying the MG34 is worse than the bar is a hilariously bad joke, the MG34 is completely fucking cracked at BR3, not that is a bad thing, I think the MG34 really makes the BR3 german lineup so fun.

Like its not even close, the main issue with the MG34 is ammo burn rate which is alleviated by use of ammo boxes and large ammo pouches. Otherwise its an amazing gun.

This isnt to say the BARA2 isnt good, it is, however its a heavy SMG, not even close to a LMG.

[CaptainBeel]

Agree with all points here. MG34 is one of the main reasons I moved from BR II to BR III Axis and yep, its a lot of fun to use. Mainly just the fact I can actually use a proper LMG.
If theres a bunch of enemies I can mount it on something and brrrrttt theyre all gone.
Which is better than the high vertical recoil of the MG13 and constantly reloading of 20 and 25 round mag LMGs.

[sku111]

I run two MG squads at BR III and with horizontal recoil, the MG 34 is absolutely brutal. And it holds its own up against Thompsons, PPSHs and BARs as well when clearing objectives.