Make Explosive Packs only able to plant

also give us spool of wire to and a plunger/blasting machine to detonate them manually from cover

The Engineers current building selection menu can be adapted to be used for this purpose, it would just need 4 options.
Plant Explosive which would dig a small hole and plant an explosive.
Wire Explosives which would pull out the wire reel and allow you to connect the explosive/explosives to the blasting machine
Blasting Machine which would put a blasting machine down in a location of your choosing capable of wiring and detonating up to 3 explosion charges
Hand Held Blasting Machine which would pull out a hand held blasting machine capable of wiring and detonating a single explosion charge


Hand Held Blasting Machine

this would make grenades more useful for attacking like breaching a position and explosion packs would be more useful in a defensive way like loading a main road with charges as you wait for the enemy to walk into the trap

cause currently everyone just equips an explosive pack… the rest of the throwables are barely ever used…

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Final battle of Saving Private Ryan intensifies

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explosive pack is ultimate anti tank weapon and balances them all. as even king tiger 2 you can kill with good explosive grenade .

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the explosive pack is stupidly overpowered for what it actually is represented as in game… 5 sticks of dynamite taped together… like i can sit in a tank shooting explosive shells at an enemy tank and it takes well over 30 shells to even cripple some tanks yet VS that same tank 1 explosive pack will vaporize the tank crew…

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And yet it takes up as much space as 1 grenade that is only 1-1.5 ounces (30-45 gm) of explosives and a steel or iron case…

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F-1 fragmentation grenade had 2 ounces of explosive and overall weight of 1.3 lbs

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IF you nerf deto then tanks would be really strong and is not viable

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According to wiki you’re looking at 8 lbs of explosives to kill a medium tank… so that F-1 is 1/4 that weight and much smaller (ferrous metals are dense) but still takes up same amount of room.

sounds about right WRT the dynamite bundle weight. usually 8 ounce sticks right?

reducing the range of packs doesnt seem like a bad idea in general to me, like … you know… it would remove the anti infantry power from it, so that normal grenades can be useful.

But i believe that tanks are alrdy very powerful, thus a anti tank nerf is definitely not needed from a ā€œgameplay balanceā€ standpoint.

perhaps being able to carry 2 grenades and only 1 deto? but yeah then bagpacks would be nerfed :rofl:

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Yup, this seems to be the main issue. Without those dynamite packs, the vast majority of infantry would be helpless to tanks. Technically that’s realistic, but it would make the game much more difficult for infantry and a whole lot easier for tanks. It would really be mandatory to have a bomber in most if not all of your squads otherwise when you come upon a tank without those packs, you may as well be a baby holding a lollipop. Looks like with the Moscow campaign, you don’t unlock the bomber class until level 9. I’ve been grinding through and recently reached level 8 with that stupid, useless, paper-thin Panzer III Ausf. B which only had 10 or 15 produced because it was a prototype that saw some use in Poland and was removed from service a year before Operation Barbarossa.

I cannot speak to the validity of a single pack holding 7 sticks of dynamite being sufficient to totally take out a tank if it goes off direction on top of, beneath, or right beside a tank. I cannot speak to how many millimeters of armour that such a pack could penetrate through. We would need to get some information brought to our attention in that regard. Maybe it’s realistic that such a pack beneath a tank would destroy it, I think it’s less likely on top of a tank but regardless, if it’s gonna be nerfed and infantry are going to be made more helpless than they already are, there needs to be solid proof that a pack of dynamite like that is truly pretty much useless against tanks, ideally also bringing information to the fold in relation to tanks of what thickness. As for the reconnaissance vehicle that uses tires that is the first German tank unlock, I suspect that at minimum, a pack of dynamite in extremely close proximity to one of those would blow out the tires if nothing else.

Also, the gap between a revolver’s cylinder and the start of the barrel releases a jet of propellant that is so violent that it could maim a shooter who rests their finger there. As such, if an in tense explosion occurs basically right on/under an armored vehicle, then if there’s any small seams or cracks in the armour that that explosion can blast into, I can envision that causing damage to any exposed tankers and of course any lines/tubes/hoses that might end up in the way too.

On top of all that, IF the ā€˜det pack’ or ā€˜deto’ as some people call it were to be nerfed/removed, something would have to be done or the infantry. What about satchel charges, could they be viable? Maybe make them accessible to engineers, whom can be accessed by just level 3 for the Germans in the Moscow campaign. In fact that’s even before we reach the ability to obtain det packs which is a level 4 unlock. That seems reasonable, although it would result in basically everyone getting at least one engineer with at least one (ideally two) satchel charges in every squad. It would also result in the engineer squad being the defacto anti-tank squad until you get the bomber, at which point people may well end up having an engineer and bomber in each squad. If those end up being the only two infantry units that can do literally anything to fight off tanks, I’d sure as Hell be making sure I have as many of 'em as possible and any squad I find that isn’t capable of having both, I’d regard that squad as being fundamentally disadvantaged compared to the others.

I do not think that tankers should feel particularly comfortable. Lt. Gen. Mikhail Kalashnikov, THAT Kalashnikov, was a tanker and was wounded. LOTS of tanks were taken out during WWII, granted probably mostly by other tanks or by stationary anti-tank cannons, with anti-tank rifles early on taking some out and probably a larger minority taken out by bazookas and PIAT and other infantry anti-tank smallarms of the sort, so the det pack itself is probably rather unrealistic. If we remove the det pack without making other anti-tank weapons more accessible, that means LOTS of ftp gamers are going to be basically helpless to tanks until 1/3rd finished the campaign, with ONLY the bomber infantry unit having any ability to defeat tanks, rendering the vast majority of soldiers on the battlefield being walking, talking (or running, screaming) tank-food.

So yeah, simply nerfing/removing det packs is not something that should be on the table unless that table also has on it a more realistic and acceptable replacement. In fact, I think that would be ideal, because it IS pretty stupid that this WWII game has everyone running around with bundles of dynamite (funny, a bundle of sticks is a fggot, so all our soldiers are running around with explosive fggots) instead of more appropriate thrown explosives like, y’know, fragmentation grenades and things like the stielhandgranate which allegedly relied more on its explosive charge than on fragments.

Explosive packs are essential to balancing against armor. I agree that the other Grenades are mostly useless. But I don’t think this is the fix.

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Simple no.
Detonation packs are THE ONLY anti tank weapon that works well, is quite affordable, for all soldiers usable.

The anti tank guns are just trash. In my whole enlisted career I killed ONE tank (and it was the basic tank) and ONLY because I was in a good side position, no one attacked my position and I needed quite some shots.

I don’t talk about Panzerfaust because they are not in every campaign and again not always available.

A tank is quite a powerful weapon and is even now a killing machine. Yes it has weak points, one of it is getting to cocky and drive into situations where you get swarmed by infrantry. But you can rack a lot of kills if you play it right.

A tank can be a very annoying object and having no weapon that works is just frustrating.

Some ppl want a distinction to hand grenades, for the sake to have a distinction. I am okay with that.

Make handgrenades lighter so that they can be thrown further. Give them an increased blast radius against infantry. I am all fine with that.

But dont touch the soldiers capability to destroy tanks.

By the way, if it will be changed in the way you suggest i could simply place an anti tank mine. Same effort with less attention needed if tank is in right place.

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Sorry but idea you presented is basically the same what anti-tank mines do, only you have to snipe them manually or wait for wehicle to cross them. I expected this topic was going to be about manually sticking explosive packs on tanks ,without option to cookthrow them.

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im not suggesting they nerf explosion packs im just asking to be able to use them in a more realistic way… if a squad knew a tank was going to come down a road they would quickly dig a shallow hole plant some explosives reel out the wire back fill the holes and wait in cover for the tank to roll by then they hit the plunger and BOOM.

yes but anti tank mines are automatic… this will be a manually operated system… if nobody hits the plunger the tank could roll right over em

the problem is people are too reliant on explosion packs so they don’t understand how else they can take out tanks… hell that’s the main reason the bomber is a non existent soldier in this game and engineers don’t even bother building AT cannons anymore

…you do realize you can take out tanks with molotov’s and flamethrowers also… hit a tank in the right spot with a molotov and that shit will blow the bitch right the fuck up

The reliance on explosion packs is a symptom, not the problem. The problem is more effective AT weaponry needs to be readily available. Bombers have their weapons, engineers have the AT cannon (I used one just a few minutes or an hour ago to take out some infantry with the HE, and seemingly gave some damage to a tank’s engine, possibly also injured the commander, but it’s hard to know what the colour shades all mean. It was a T-26 I’m pretty sure, so a light tank. Earlier than that, I set one up at a location where I gave rather ineffectual help to two tanks nearby who was taking on an enemy tank. The enemy tank lost. Then, before that, on that big snowy map, I managed to take out a tank I couldn’t even properly see. I noticed the green/red coloration of the reticle, the tank was behind some brush. I took some shots and discovered it was ass-on to me, so I pounded its rear and after a few hits, pop goes the weasel. I more effective AT cannon would be helpful…

Molotovs aren’t as effective against tanks as the explosion packs, and if those packs were removed then as I mentioned, the majority of infantry would be helpless, and it’s not fun to be helpless. So if the packs are to be scrapped or nerfed, there needs to be some other way of dealing with tanks available, and early on. I don’t know what the solution is, but if packs are removed then tanks are going to end up being terribly OP with extremely few soldiers being able to do anything about them.

I’d still like to see some research done in regards to what sorts of explosives are truly needed to take out a tank from the outside, because it might turn out that a bundle of 7 dynamite strapped together is sufficient. If so, then it should not be nerfed because it is performing as it would in real life.

It’s hard to know what the solution is, but I’d want more info before it’s nerfed. I also think it’s right for tankers to fear being too close to, or surrounded by, enemy infantry. If a tank feels indestructible in the face of anything but other tanks or enemy bombers, then something isn’t right.

They could do with a rework, but it requires a lot of additional steps with it apart from just nerfing packs.