Bro, for a baby, a basketball might be more lethal… 15j…This amount of kinetic energy can’t even penetrate clothing or Cannot penetrate adult skin…
well that is shown as lowest end. anyway if you have problem with classification of what causes serious injury, then take it with Air Force Safety Center Weapons Safety Division (U.S.) and US department of energy.
also dont try to minimize argument when it is on scale from 15-78 for serious injury and 79+ for severe injury and death.
also SWCSD defines hazardous fragment as one having impact energy of 79+J
The kinetic energy of a pistol bullet is about 400-500 joules.
So what? The kinetic energy of 15J would only cause injury. In the game, it should translate to a damage value of only 1
for .22 long
for .22 short
this is energy of bullet at end of barrel , give it little distance and strength drops rapidly.
lol.
IIRC steel penetration was one of measures for lethality you used earlier in topic.
Then I just made a mistake. 58 foot-pounds is approximately 78.6 joules, and the document has corresponding casualty standards
According to the document you referenced, the standard for death is simply 79 joules.
In this game, a 9mm pistol round can only cause 6 damage, while a 7.62 pistol round causes 5.5 damage. Their kinetic energy is between 400 to 500 joules. Therefore, one-fifth of that kinetic energy would result in approximately 1 damage.
The M107 is a 155 mm high explosive projectile used by many countries. It is a bursting round with fragmentation and blast effects. It used to be the standard 155 mm high explosive projectile for howitzers of the US Army and US Marine Corps, but is being superseded in the US military by the M795.
The complete projectile weighs 43.2 kg (95 lb), is 800 mm (31 in) long and contains 15.8% explosive by weight.
how nice that you showed what ~7kg explosives can do…
I really find it difficult to explain things to people without scientific literacy. The flight distance of shrapnel is not a linear relationship with the amount of explosive; it depends on the shrapnel’s drag and velocity. Although a 155mm shell has only 7 to 8 kg of explosives, its shrapnel lethality range is about 60 to 70% that of a 500 lb bomb.
I have nothing more to say… These two images illustrate enough. The document has detailed that the kill zone of the MK82 is 80x30, and it also provides a computer simulation of the MK82. I think you might just be a troll. It’s meaningless to waste time discussing this with you.
nah… you only find it difficult to explain to people that question your narrative.
now i question your reading capability. HFD show distance AFTER which you will either have low chance of getting hit or AFTER which impact will not be lethal if you get hit.
people have died from 4,5mm BB gun that actually has less than 15J energy.
So its not exactly all that simple.
https://unsaferguard.org/un-saferguard/gurney
Assumed sharp objects with average weight of 1-20grams moving with speed of ~1400ms
But past 30m they are just fluffy cottonballs.
Dunno, seems your science is quite alot off.
for me it is fascinating that bullets which weigh ~12 grams and have initial velocity ~800m/s can kill people thousand of meters away, but bomb fragment which can be over 20g and can have initial speed of 2440m/s cant kill a person past 50-60m by his logic.
also 5+ minutes incapacitation is totally harmless in battle. you just shrug it off and go fight like normal… maybe we should introduce 5 minutes timeout if you are hit with fragment past some range…
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I’m really at a loss for words. Grenade fragments can reach speeds above 2000 m/s. If you don’t understand aerodynamics, in your world, a single grenade could probably cause a lethal range of 60 meters.
The energy range of 15–79 joules can be evaluated from its lower to upper limits. The lower end, 15–20 joules, is comparable to the kinetic energy of a BB pellet, which is indeed very light and may struggle to penetrate clothing. The 20–78 joule range could potentially cause injury, perhaps resulting in an unlucky person suffering a head wound with bleeding or even a severe concussion, but under normal circumstances, it should not be lethal.
However, in the context of a game, where a full-power bullet with 4000 joules deals 13.2–25.6 damage, an M43 bullet with 1900 joules deals 9.9 damage, and a handgun bullet with 400–500 joules deals 5.5–6.5 damage, 79 joules would equate to roughly 1 point of damage based on this scaling. Moreover, the non-lethal fragments you’ve been discussing, which are below 79 joules, would translate to 0–0.9 damage in the game.
In a game, if you’re hit by a 9mm bullet with 400 joules, you can still run and jump around. According to your logic, the game should have you fall into a coma immediately upon taking 0.2 damage.
I’m a bit skeptical about your reading ability.
Even if there are still lethal fragments outside the lethal zone, it statistically no longer holds significance. The computer simulation of the MK82 shows that its fatality rate has already reached 0. HFD has informed you that even if hit, it won’t be fatal
I assume you are referring to hand grenades which has quite significantly smaller amount of explosives.
And still, 15m radius from hand grenade is considered rather dangerous if not even lethal.
But fragments from bomb with 99kg of explosives are hardly nothing else than fluffy cotton balls past 30m ?
i knew you were going to use aerodynamics for this argument. cause i was too lazy to use actual physics calculation i used grok to calculate for me(so maybe inaccurate). object mass 20g, initial velocity 2440m/s, drag coefficient 1(bullet has ~0.28)
here is calculation
here is kinetic energy at this distance:
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At 100 m: 14.96 kJ
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At 150 m: 7.49 kJ
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At 200 m: 3.76 kJ
added few more distances
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At 250 m: 1.88 kJ
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At 300 m: 0.94 kJ
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At 400 m: 0.24 kJ
these values seem lethal to me… for ease of calculating energy you can divide them with 10 or 100 to get fragments of 2g or 0.2g size.
also here are results for 30° and 60° launch angle
Spoiler
So what? Even if it exists, the book has already told you, 'The HFD distance is one with a low probability of being hit by a hazardous fragment, and if one were hit after all, the impact would not be lethal.
then why are you behaving like in game there is 100% chance of fragment hitting you at 120m? there is extremely low chance of fragment hitting you at that distance in the game.
also incapacitation also includes serious injury and death.
this is all about probability and not absolute certainty. at that distance(300m) you have ~1% chance of fragment hitting you. out of those fragments there is then certain percentage of them that is lethal.
also we are not talking about 300m distance in the game, but about 120m.
Simply put, I don’t fully trust AI’s calculation results. Whether it’s the chart for the Mk82 or the 100kg IED, both indicate the kill zone ends at 30-40 meters.