Competitive matches : why Enlisted it's not ready for it and how to do it?

Suggestions
1

Don’t take me wrong…

…the game is awesome and we can have unlimited hours of fun…
…but it lacks the competitive flame.

If by one side you must play against and with bots to enjoy the experience…

By the other side you are far… far… away from the action… and once again dead, takes a good time to get back to it. It becomes boredom fast.

[Play with bots OR enjoy boredom]

“Learn from history”.

image

I’m a bit suspicious because i’m a huge fan of the label Day of Defeat (Dod 1.3), developed and released in 2003 by Valve.

Twice champion of one of the national champinships and league co-manager by 2 national cup seasons.

If we can learn something with it:

The game was perfect from a competitive point of view as counter strike is… until today.

A huge community has developed from this game because it.

Here in Brazil, as well as in several countries around the world, independent and sponsored leagues were created to promote competitive matches and complex championships.

In 2003 we had the LiBRA (Brazilian League) sponsored by iG. Brazilian Dod Cup, and LPDOD South America Cup.

At its peak (2003/2004/2005), we had 32 teams (around 320 advanced players) competing for first, second and third place in 3 different divisions in just one of our 3 leagues.

International leagues? Yes, we had a huge movement at Cyberathlete Amateur League

HOW?

Very balanced small maps, meticulously developed for close-combats from a competitive point of view.

WHY DOD died?

It’s not dead. The South America Dod Cup stills active 19 years later the game was launched.

Everyday i see them gathering for training, mix and official matches.

WHY THEY DON’T LIKED DOD SOURCE (released in 2005)?

DOD SOURCE had lots of attention but it lost many of the competitive aspects as they failed with the hitbox.

Again… don’t take me wrong…

I’m not making any comparison or depreciating Enlisted.

I loved it and it’s already my favorite by now…

But, judging by the work on developing larger maps and everything you’ve already achieved as it’s plataform…

It would be easy to put some effort on the competitive format, delivering smaller close-combat maps, maybe looking at the best established Day of Defeat 1.3 maps, such as dod_donner, dod_anzio or dod_railroad_b2.

REFERENCES

  • Day of Defeat 1.3 Meta Critic (79 metascore - 9.1 user score)

  • Dod Source Meta Critic (80 metascore - 9 user score)

  • Search for Day of Defeat on Steam
    (Not allowed to link it)

  • Search for Dod Source on Steam
    (Not allowed to link it)

VIDEOS

Legend of the Game - Marshall Drummin (Player Video)
youtube - watch?v=G-S7vZr5-8Y

DoD - zP! vs. begrip (Official match VOD)
youtube - watch?v=_FB7AcyP3zw

compLexity DoD (Clan video)
youtube - watch?v=mJWYlbsK9r4

An1maL - Reflex (Player Video)
youtube - watch?v=B1_nns-Xslc

I’m certain that if you deliver this competitive approach we’re about to get lots of competitions here.

Best Regards!

3

Nope, Enlisted is not going for e-sport and not for extreme competitive gaming.
It is designed with bots to fill the match and reduce the human vs human chances and thus being friendly to who do not good at FPS.
If you want to play without bots, see lonefighters, full of snipers.
Playing the game is more fun than see someone playing. E-sport will just leave majority players who is not that good at FPS alone.

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4

enlisted is not ready, and WILL not make it work.

because the devs were the first announcing and openly say that competitive it’s not the main focus of the title. does not matter how many kills you will make. but how much you play the objective.

simple as that.

they also answered in a Q&A about it.

it’s not their priority. and if it comes, it will be much more later in the years.

from my perception, from what they announced we’ll might start thinking about E sports in about 2/3 years.

weather for the competitive aspect, private servers have been announced. but also those will came much further down the line. as such, community games will be an option.

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5

nah don’t make it a competitve sh*tshow, its better to stay where its just casual, chaotic fun…

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6

we don’t care play CHIT S

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7

I’m not suggesting that they change the game that already exists…

But add the capability to enjoy competitive perspective.

Don’t you like it? Well, stay with what you already have.

Many will like the other way too.

8

Well by suggesting that you are pretty much saying that devs should abandon their intentions of not making this game for competetive play and thus change their very core of development plans.

Devs already stated that this game is not going to the e-sports or competetive matches path and I see no reason for it to change. Also bot squads are one of the main things that makes this game unique… just see how awful lone fighters are (added despite maps and main gamemodes are not designed for that, until game was made F2P this mode was almost abandoned because it was obviously released against most people´s wishes on this very forum).

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9

Esports are bad and you should feel bad

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10

IMHO, e-sports brings a lot of toxicity into gaming community in general. It does pretty much nothing positive to the game development nor gaming communities, but tries to make commercialization of something that people like to do just for fun. I accept commercialization of sports, at least that can have a positive effect on kids if it motivates them to live a healthier life style or just doing sports as teenager is beneficial. Gaming on other hand, doesn’t have much of regular health benefits and is something done for various reasons and most of those reasons are about improving your psychological state (not health) in one or another way. One could argue that competitive games do that too and I agree, but not e-sports. There are plenty of competitive games already, don’t need to turn others into even more of those.
BF5 had a plague of these e-sports people who come into regular matches and make impression that you play against cheaters.

1 Like
11

Too much anger on e-sports.

I’m 42 yo, participated and love to see a competitive match… sponsored or not… specially bc they gather advanced players and we can see nasty and awesome plays.

Again, not asking to leave their plans… but ADD the competitive capability by just delivering some small close combat maps to the game AND the controls to command the competitive game setup.

You can have a large community of 4fun players… and a great community interested in competitive matches too…

You all saying this… seems that Enlisted will gather only noobs… afraid of competitions or advanced players… They don’t bite and just want to have fun in a powerful community.

From the competitive player point of view… it

12

continues:

From the competitive player point of view… it’s awesome to have all the sinergy that a competitive scenario provides… It generates great moments, lots of new friends and a powerful group that sticks to the game for a long time, generating tons os great game content.

Playing just 4fun… the game becomes boring sooner and the players leave sooner too.

Just saying… the game already try a more competitive game… by letting you to play the lone fighter mode… but the experience playing that mode sucks by now. The way to fix it is looking to the format of Day of Defeat… a 9.1 user score on meta critic.

Metrics don’t lie… even as few guys say the opposite.

13

Lone Fighters was created only because few people in CBT demanded an option to play without AI squads. And it was almost dead until some new players came with start of OBT.

But you still miss the point here - Enlisted was never meant to go fully into competitive mode and e-sport. So to do that devs would have to abandon their own plans to create yet another gamemode, only to try to satisfy another group of players. And as we all know it is impossible to satisfy everyone. So maybe it is better for them to focus on what they really wanted to do with Enlisted and create non competitive game that tries to recreate the atmoshere of a real battle - not few guys running on a small map and playing e-sport.

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14

That’s the point, we don’t need “competition”, we need fun gameplay. If you enjoy competitive gaming, stick to those games. Like BF5 doesn’t have a restriction on “rank” as CS has and “competitive” players who walk into a casual match are just pain in the ***. It’s not interesting to play against them as we don’t play against individuals but against enemy team as a whole.
The other aspect is a kind of try hard culture that e-sports inspire, where every mechanics gets abused. Then this transcends into a normal matches and devs have to patch it out. This is the main reason why every BF game since Bad Company nerfs each weapon to a point that they become all the same and everyone uses the same AR or MG. I personally don’t want to see this crap in all games.

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15

It’s kinda selfish to say that “we don’t need competition”…

YOU and a cluster of player want only fun gameplay… it’s ok.

I didn’t asked them to drop the fun…

Just to plan a few small map for WHO WANTS to play it in a competitive way…

They already tried to do it by releasing the lone fighter mode… but those large maps don’t fit.

Furthermore… it’s easy to release a small map and test if the players are going to stick to it or not.

I bet that many player will… =D

Small maps. closer and fast paced combats… competitive match mechanics.

PLEASE!

16

It’s not “just few small maps”. It would mean creating another gamemode with those maps only. And creating separate balance for those small maps. All balance between weapons in Enlisted exists on bgger maps and even those are too small for big part of community (I belive the bigger part considering how many posts there are about making maps bigger in comparision with those who want to shrink them even more). What about mortars, artillery, planes and tanks on “competitive” and small maps? What about all bolt action rifles, snipers etc? It would end in few players running around only with SMGs and LMGs.

Because the whole design of the game never considered something like Lone Fighter before some players started crying about not wanting to play with AI squads.

They released Lone Fighters. And people didn’t stick. It was almost dead until new wave of players came with OBT.

SMG, LMG and grenades spam leaving all other weapons in the trashcan

Enlisted was designed to be something different. If you don’t like it or want it to make 180 degree turn and become something it was not supposed to be - maybe you should stick to the games that were meant to be competitive and will make it 100% better.

17

Decision to introduce lonefighters had nothing to do with demand for competetive matches, because there wasn´t any such demand. The only reason lone fighters mistake exist, was demand for gamemode without bots on the same maps that were built upon an idea of big scale battles with AI in it.

Not to mention that creating yet another mode would achieve nothing but splitting playerbase even further.

18

As others have said this game was not intended to be an e-sport game so stop trying to make it that. If you like e-sports that’s okay. There are plenty of other cookie cutter FPS’s to fill that niche … Just not enlisted.

1 Like
19

Finally found an old channel that I’ve liked at first, till I started to pay attention to the attitude of the guy towards other players:

He and his friends are good competitive BF players. He has a great recoil control and auto weapons used by him look like they don’t have recoil at all. What does he do with these skills? Goes into regular public servers and laughs at people calling him a hacker. If you are so good in this game, why don’t you use some challenging weapons, something that is legitimate hard to do? No idea, perhaps it’s because the whole point of his channel is to make fun of other people who don’t play as good as him.
I don’t want this rubbish to be supported by mechanics of the game, as it’s done in BF.

20

@Eloros… i get that you don’t like the approach… but when we try the “non bot” mode… it’s because we’re looking to play something harder than killing one player and his 6 bots after…

I do respect your point of view… and i like to play it on every mode or maps.

Just saying that if we have a mode with few small maps… it can provide another mode of fun and still provide the capability of the competitive approach for who like it too.

I don’t get is why prevent people from having fun with competitive just because few don’t like it?

Sounds selfish AF.

Look COD Warzone… they have large map mode and a closer approach for those who like a fast paced game…

Every week they try new modes and special events… everybody having fun the way they like it individually…

I think we can make everybody happy instead of making this a flag against it or that.

21

Devs don´t like it, that is the main point. I merely support the original idea.

As for my personal bias again lone fighters… I´m not saying that could never work, however, that mode just doesn´t work on current maps because they weren´t (and still aren´t) designed for it. That is the case because copy paste FPS is not even their main approach or idea behind Enlisted.
Besides, Darkflow is not a big studio, thus I doubt that dividing development time between main “ideology” behind Enlisted, and working on a new mode is feasible.