See title.
No reason to have them be separate classes.
Let anyone who has them keep those soldiers, but any new purchases will be called “Troop Carrier I” and “Troop Carrier II”
APC Driver is a misnomer if the unlockable versions are literally regular trucks, with properly armored vehicles behind premium and events.
well, no.
to this day, you still haven’t figured out what riders are all about.
riders fast response team on vehicles
APC support vehicles & mobile rally
which, i still like them being different and being in different squads.
with that being said;
they just need being able to use armored vehicles of low numbers ( such as mg with machineguns, which i miss over the main thread )
scout vehicles etc.
apc on the other hand, could use more AFVs that are slow and slighlty bigger. perhaps spg on wheels too? since the stummel technically is an spg afv of the german army. therefore, we could get T48s/SU-57, gun motor carriers ( murican one ) etc
to make sense as a rally point.
rather than collapsing entirely bikers because someone hasn’t figured out how to use them yet ( or dislikes them because not meta enough for him/her).
We’ve been over this.
That and they cost about as much as a regular infantry squad to spawn.
Great value for your team’s tickets spawning a 2-3 man squad over a 6-9 man one.
apparently you haven’t.
it really is.
being able to flank rallies, tanks or place a rally avoiding going into the points gun blaising or in the enemy’s throats, bikers to this day are still a viable pick for a variety of tasks.
otherwise those would have been long removed.
now, there could be an argument of the class rider it self how is being underused. because just like in real life, they didn’t had one soldier in particular for a bike.
matter of fact, most were trained to be drivers in the first place ( when speaking in the recognizance teams ) and maybe even outside.
but the class would become useful and viable if the rider squads get access to cars with mgs, 8 rads, and other fighting vehicles.
similar to how the apc work as it goes for the class it self.
yet, bikers should be slighlty different as their purpose and objective is a different kind.
once again, riders are for the offensive, apc more for the defensive role.
you don’t flank with apcs ( you can, but much trickier due to their speed ) as you don’t use bikes for defending. ( you could do that either. just not efficiently and not specifically designed for that. as the doctrine it self it’s around high mobility and great gun with no recoil )
as, the rider it self, it’s actually a driver / tanker class.
and has it’s roles.
which the though should be about expanding and improving them.
not removing them ( because good luck with that )
You conveniently left out the asterisk (*) where its viability is dependent on map design, vehicle accessibility and how much LoS the enemy has when you approach, where the vehicle spawn is relative to the infantry, and how its engine is quite audible from a distance.
It’s ability to navigate the battlefield is limited by the tricycle layout which hampers your ability to turn and is otherwise very easy to trip over, and you’re ever seen by anyone on the enemy team, congratulations, you wasted a squad’s worth of tickets, and you don’t even get the consolation prize an APC driver would where even if you wipe the crew, the team can still respawn on it and fight to keep it alive.
And that’s not withstanding what people usually do with bikes when they inevitably replace the 2 riders you start with with an engineer and at gunner, or some other specialist of your choosing.
The Rider squad doesn’t need Riders whereas APCs need an APC driver.
Or we could just consolidate the two classes and give them a reason to exist.
The only reason people would ever bring up a bike squad is for memes, not for practicality.
except that goes for pretty much everything?
how is just bikers problems?
and so are anti tanks, and so are medics, and so are engineers etc. heck, even tank destroyers.
that’s all ya got?
most of them aren’t meta for the plebs standards because apparently what’s being played the most are assaulters, machinegunners and flamethrowers.
should we just get rid of 90% of the stuff just because aren’t being used by the masses?
not sure what do you mean by this
… because bikes aren’t silents nor will ever be?
they don’t even have to.
it’s a goddamn bike
" skill ceiling " might be higher than just using an smg.
at least, looks like it.
but just like certain equipment, it requires prework to it.
jump down from the bike, use the bino, gather where the most of the enemies are coming from, or if one area is more crowded then another and the strike around the flanks.
can be difficult, can be easy.
as they say, no risk no rewards.
and i’ll tell you that much.
doesn’t help my case, but sure i am biased on bikes.
which everyone should try them and fully upgrade them.
legit the most fun one can have.
securing friendly paras landing zone, escort and secure friendly tanks from slighlty afar, cutting down reinforcements, place a rally, ambush enemy tanks, so on and on.
it depends from certain factors, but is really rewarding as fun.
i’m sure everyone has their own. but as far as it goes for the bike it self, it’s a tool, that can make the best of most situations if used correctly and properly.
that’s barely a reason at all with no concrete benefits or actual explanations.
it’s like asking to combine / merge together machinegunners and assaulters just because they both use automatic weapons.
no, that’s not reasonable any way shape or form just because they share weapons of the same firing type.
or as far as it goes for bikers and apc, just because they drive vehicles, they are not the same thing.
nope.
which instead, the focus should be to bring more attentions to what the rider squad could be with the addition of actual armored light vehicles.
like 222s, 8rads, ba64s, m3 scout cars, type 87s, and many, many mores.
so that you start with a bike, which it’s still great if you want to flank and place some rally, or ambush or whatever, AND THEN upgrade to slighlty more powerful vehicles as a " bite and run " tactic in a slighlty efficent way by losing the other perks of a bike.
p.s. once more, just because you can’t figure out how to make something work, or don’t personally use it your self, doesn’t mean it needs to be removed.
No. Lmao. It’s a handicapped vehicle squad whose only gimmick is be small and fast, but rendered useless by terrain.
Tanks do not need to close the distance, so terrain hardly matters.
The usefulness of the bike squad is heavily dependent on how it navigates the battlefield.
I’m proposing consolidating the two soldier types into one.
Don’t turn this into an unrelated debate regarding the other classes.
“Vehicle accesibility” refers to the map’s navigability. The more cluttered the map is, the more obstacles you need to navigate to go from point A to point B. It is easy to move bike squads in Tunisia because of its openness, but nigh-useless in Berlin or Stalingrad due to the amount of ground clutter.
Especially when it means slowing down to finesse your way through gaps increases the likelihood of you being shot.
If you pretend I’m not making an argument, that doesn’t mean there wasn’t an explanation.
It just means there wasn’t an explanation you’re willing to accept.
“Guys, the bike squad is practical.”
“We just need things that aren’t bikes.”
Cue laugh track
Like letting Riders be able to drive APCs, etc?
And vice-versa.
The idea is to combine both classes into 1.
Existing classes will continue to exist.
New copies of the soldier type will be the new combined soldier you can then use for both bike and apc squads.
it’s not.
how the user uses it*
which there’s no need for it.
especially considering that those are literally two different squads for different purpose.
you just did that.
guess who uses them.
guess who doesn’t have these problems.
basically anyone with half a brain cell and knows how to drive a bike in a game.
just like pretty much anything in this game.
the same goes for the apc if that’s the matters.
and hardly anyones complains about that.
except, you’re trying to force your own argument without actually thinking it through, or accept others arguments.
ah yes straw man argument because you have nothing to say.
That wasn’t the point at all.
typical.
So, to conclude, let me make it simple for you. So that, even a toddler can get it.
Riders =/= Apc drivers
They are not.
One is used more offensively, the other more defensively.
They were not designed to do the same thing. Matter of fact, they are in different squads and do different things. It would defeats the whole purpose if you combine them.
And you can go on and on about ranting about the problems that you can’t wrap your head around the bike.
Which it’s fine. Not everything was made to suit you. What is less fine, is how someone who i bet didn’t even fully grinded a single bike or used them for more than one minutes takes them away to others and barely understand how those works in the first place.
Beside that point,
I’m telling you, as someone who uses them, and see potentials in those, to make bikes more interesting, would be to add more vehicles to it.
Believe it or not, *shocker that includes more bikes too.
Kettenkrads, the bike with 3 soldiers, and upgrade them to get more firepower and use the biker “ differently “ for those who wants and get cars and what not. Or, if they desire, remains with bikes.
It’s not that deep.
But you keep running in circles instead. So.
All I’m gonna say, is good luck. You’ll probably need it.
Is this true? I assumed the number of tickets used was equal to the number of people in the squad.
Does every squad spawned consume the same number of tickets? And if so - how many?
They’re basically the same. Bike riders are I and APC drivers are II.
Same as medics are I and assaulters are II-IV.
technically, yes.
no they’re not.
you see, bikers and apc drivers do share in common some perks.
but they drive different vehicles, and are used for different purposes.
medics are completely different because assaulters do not have medic perks.
nor syringes, nor anything. and, no ammo.
not to mention, used differently too.
It’s about perks. They’re obv two different classes. That wasn’t my point.
ah i see
So just have the rider class be able to drive the APC and the Motorcycle?
Me: 5 hours late to the topic
Also me:
This could all be solved if we just had a driver class who can drive everything lol.
That would be too simple and too logical.
