Change BR to be based on Historical Implementation

[Wieloglow]

Yes. Because players will have no incentive to play and collect XP if best weapons (BAR + Fedorov) will be available just at the beginning.

(game will look very cheap)

[CaptainSebekel]

@Lthiddensniper

and also certain the German have a powerful pre war weapon

Such as?

[Lthiddensniper]

not on the top of my head, looking for someone to mention one, I could be wrong. if I’m wrong nobody cares because everyone hates the Germans anyways.

[Lthiddensniper]

Limiting some weapons that there wasn’t a huge number of produced could be a solution.
It’d be an idea, never said itd was completely baked.

[Kriegerfaust007]

@CaptainSebekel

@Lthiddensniper

and also certain the German have a powerful pre war weapon

Such as?

MG 13-14-30-34

MP-18-28-30-34-38

• Flammenwerfer 35

[SzepWaxweiler]

There are but those are infact were only prototypes and would be too powerful for your HA based MM
For italy

@SzepWaxweiler

Scotti Naval rifle(2 variants )(AR(assault rifle)

(With and without stock one was used as AA)

The Scotti Naval Model was developed in the early 1930s. It was proposed to the Italian Navy as a potential anti-aircraft weapon for sailors, specifically for targeting low-flying planes that posed a threat to patrol boats. After undergoing brief evaluation, the Scotti Naval rifle was not adopted and development of the weapon ceased. Only a few prototypes were made.

(This is sketch for further development of rifle most likely never left the table as Scotti naval rifle was not adopted)

Tipo terni model 1921 (yes again but as a SF rifle)(fires intermediate cartilage

The cartridge was an experimental 7.35x32mm using the 6.5x55 base dimensions propelling a 8.71 gram bullet to 600 m/s (135 gr at 2000 fps). This gun competed in an Italian trial in May 1923, alongside a 6.5mm carbine and three 9mm Glesenti submachine gun designs. The Terni rifle was the only favored design and was further developed in 1928, but never went beyond the prototype stage.(The rifle in this picture is a semi-auto prototype, but selective-fire models were actually made. and Amazingly, a few of these guns have actually recently been discovered in Ethiopia, so they must have been issued to a limited extent during the Italo-Ethiopian War of 1935. They were made in semi-automatic and selective-fire variations.)(7.35x32mm which I guess is kind of intermediate cartilage so if we ever get select-fire version of this it would be considered an AR also 25-round “strip feed” box magazineDetachable box magazine)

@SzepWaxweiler

Beretta Model 1937(Model 1931 is in game Radio operator premium from Tunisia )

@SzepWaxweiler

Italian Granade launcher rifles

@SzepWaxweiler

Breda grenade launcher 1929

Genovesi-Revelli self-loading rifle of 1908( Revelli-Terni)

@SzepWaxweiler

Maefassi gas-operated conversion of the Mannlicher M.95(8x56mmR)

An Italian officer, Carlos Maefassi, designed this gas-operated, self-loading conversion of the Mannlicher M.95 rifle, while he was stationed in Ethiopia in the late 1930s. The conversion operates on a basic underbarreled gas piston with a long rack to allow the straight-pull bolt to reciprocate. A pistol grip was added to the stock. The Maefassi conversion was tested in about 1940 but never advanced beyond a prototype.

Cei-rigotti(4 models)(SF(selct fire)\

Important read this before
The capacity of the original 6.5mm version was 6 (rifle/carbine), 25 (rifle), and 30 (carbine) (two-row column mag) rounds. All were fixed magazines that were only removable for cleaning (removal of the magazine required removal of the trigger guard). According to surviving documents, they should have been refilled using a 6-round, large 25-round, or two 15-round charger clips, respectively. Later developed 7.65mm models had either a 10-round or 20-round magazine.

(the colored picture is model 1901)

(Naval model of model 1895)

Now for LMGs

Fiat model 1928

was trialed against Breda model.30

Fiat model S 1922

@SzepWaxweiler

Experimental Fiat-Revelli Magazine conversion

FIAT 14 EXPERIMENTAL(was taken from Patton1998)

MAB 38A P.A.I

A mab 38 with bayonet different composer and different recoil pattern use by Italian african police

Armaguerra Mod. 35

The Armaguerra Mod. 35 was a blowback-operated submachine gun. It had no select-fire capability and fired exclusively in full-auto. The weapon feeds from detachable box magazines feeding from a magazine well located on the right of the weapon.

@SzepWaxweiler

FIAT-Revelli submachine gun

In December 1916, the Italian Test Commission observed the demonstration of a new weapon known as the Moschetto Automatico Revelli. This gun had been commissioned by the Air Artillery Corps, presumably for use as an automatic carbine by pilots or aerial observers, and was developed jointly by FIAT of Turin and RIV of Pinerolo, with the design work being attributed to Col. Abiel Revelli. The FIAT/Revelli “automatic musket” was essentially a conversion of the twin-barreled Villar Perosa 9mm machine-gun into a single-barreled, shoulder-fired carbine by installing a single Villar Perosa receiver onto a wooden stock and fitting it with a conventional trigger group. Everything about the delayed-blowback action was unchanged and the overhead 25-round magazine feed was retained. The design was improved, however, by the addition of a fire selector switch which gave automatic fire and single shots. Other modifications were entirely external. When the bolt was in the closed position, the bolt handle would sit in a metal cup which it was lifted out of by a retracting lever similar to that of the Villar Perosa’s. The downward-facing ejection port was fitted with a curved case deflector which would redirect the spent casings forward of the firer.

You see most of them are prototypes and most of them would be too powerfull if HA MM would be implanted

And this is only for Italy You can do this to Czechs and Germans and even Finland and Hungary, too and then every body would play European axis since HA MM would favor them and meanwhile Japan would type HEI automatic rifle in BR 1 with Tokyo arsenal and while we can find counters to these for both american and soviets it would create an other problem why should anyone in BR1(who starts the game for first time)face these it would lit. turn the game to being what it was pre-merge

[CaptainSebekel]

@Kriegerfaust007

MG 13-14-30-34

MG14 is not ingame.
MG13 is far worse than M1918 and DP-27.
MG30 is premium.
MG34 is not better or worse than DP27.

@Kriegerfaust007

MP-18-28-30-34-38

MP18 is premium.
MP28 sucks.
MP30 is not ingame unless its Steyr MP30 which is MP34(o).
MP34 is worse than PPD or Thompson.
MP38 is worse than PPD or Thompson.

[SzepWaxweiler]

@CaptainSebekel

MP30 is not ingame unless its Steyr MP30 which is MP34(o).

It is same as MP-34(O)

[CaptainSebekel]

@Lthiddensniper

if I’m wrong nobody cares because everyone hates the Germans anyways.

Someone needs to play against you Soviet simps unless you want full bot expierence again.

[CaptainSebekel]

I can already imagine the totally coincidental MM situation:
1939 - 1941: Xaxaxaxaxa!
1942 - 1943: Reich Time!
1944 - 1945: Still Reichtime and all sane Allied players that don’t want to face Tigers and Panthers with the M10.

That is a 40D chess move. I can already see the growth.

[Josephs_Piano]

@Lthiddensniper

Rather than based on power we can make BR based on when the gun was put into service. Questions?

Not a good idea - PPSh in 1942 is by far and away a better weapon than anything opposing it, and KV-1 and T-34 in 1941 are just unfair!

If you are going to do that then you have to implement some form of “cost” to bringing the better weapons - lots of historical wargames (figure games on tabletop) and even many fantasy games do this, but the Gaijin stable of games seems unwilling to do so.

[Lthiddensniper]

I’m a Soviet simp? wrong, German main, hate most if not all of the Russian equipment. The soviets are my least played faction I think.

[Lthiddensniper]

Fair point on some of that equipment, I wouldn’t mind a point system/cost to bring things, kind of like how in Warhammer each unit has a cost. Otherwise it’s crazy to think of 9 man squads with FG-42s and 3 EPs each.

[Josephs_Piano]

Yes Warhammer was the fantasy game I was thinking of - don’t play it - historicals myself, but lots of people around here do.

[Lthiddensniper]

I’d love to get into but it’s an expensive hobby to stack on top of MTG and D&D.
But yeah, considering only squad leader would have a semiauto weapon for the longest time this whole system surprised me.

[GENxCatrenko]

I dont think anymore we would need to change BR’s or queues for then anymore as this idea below would actually help without entirely overhaulling the game

@GENxCatrenko

So I know I’ve previously went over this a post ago. But it was only briefly thought of. I’m thinking of it and hearing more people out. What about we actually DO presets but leave 2 extra spots exclusively for battle themed premium/event squads.

[JAREDUP]

TBH what should have happened was let individual campaign selection happen, but you would set up a BR loadout for that campaign. So whenever you randomly get said campaign your loadout would determine BR on that map. We would still have a tech tree, just certain equipment would be limited to certain campaigns.

For example Moscow could go up to BR 5 because of PPSH or Fed. but other BR5 equipment would not be allowed such as STGs or IS-2s.

So in theory Moscow could be BR 1-5. Just the equipment is limited on each campaign. Though it would still be random map selection.

[khtk395]

@JAREDUP

For example Moscow could go up to BR 5 because of PPSH or Fed. but other BR5 equipment would not be allowed such as STGs or IS-2s.

So in theory Moscow could be BR 1-5. Just the equipment is limited on each campaign. Though it would still be random map selection.

I don’t see the point of doing such thing.
Germany don’t have much available counter, so they will just not bring br5 equipment to Moscow.
In the end you won’t even get a match or just fight with bots.

[JAREDUP]

Isn’t the match making BR3-BR5? There’s plenty of gear to suffice.

MG34 is BR 3, M38 is BR4, MkB is BR 5. etc

[khtk395]

@JAREDUP

MG34 is BR 3,

Soviet has DT-29 and Maxim Tokarev

@JAREDUP

MkB is BR 5. etc

I though you want some HA? MKB42 was not in service during Moscow.

Not to mention Soviet also have T-34 and KV-1.