Several noticeable unbalancedness (is that even a word) in the Pacific Campaign

Greetings, and thank you for taking the time to read this post. Here I would like to list out the problems I have noticed while playing the Pacific Campaign, and provide possible remedies.

Apologies for any grammatical and/or typographical error.

Note that this article is written within less than a month of the release of the Pacific Theater. As such it is to be expected that there will be glaring problems within the campaign design. I would like to thank the developer for adding the Pacific Campaign in the first place.

First, the Armored Vehicles match up. The M13 Anti-Aircraft Half-Track; In comparison to the Ta-Se Anti-Aircraft Tank, the M13 has a much higher infantry clearing potential. Moreover, for an infantryman to eliminate the tank crew, the Ta-Se crew is far easier to kill than the M13, with their heads poking out quite far from the top, while the M13 gunner is well protected behind the gun placement. In a game where Infantry is the key to victory, this is heavily biased towards the US.

Now to be fair the developers, I don’t think there really is a way to fix this mismatch without changing too much of the tank line up, as the US .50 cal HMG is far superior to anything Japan can field in real life (in the context of being a highly versatile weapon for both anti-infantry and anti-air).

Secondly, Japanese weaponry. The Americans’ basic rifle is the Springfield 1903 (7.62mm) while the Japanese gets the Type 38 Carbine (6.5mm). The American first purchasable rifle is the USMC variant of the Springfield; Very much the same fun with the addition of protected sights, while the Japanese gets the Type 38 Rifle.

I would suggest that the Japanese get the Type 38 Rifle as the basic rifle instead of a carbine in order to compete with the Americans. As for the first purchasable rifle, the Japanese should get the Type 99 Rifle (Late), not the Type 38 Rifle, as that would put the Japanese gun somewhat on par with the Americans in terms of bullet caliber (7.62 to 7.7, instead of 6.5).

Moreover, at Level 11, the US gets a Shotgun while Japan gets a sword. I think this is self explanatory. It would make sense for the Japanese to get an SMG at Level 11 to compete with the American Shotgun, as there is a precedent for two weapons of similar role but not equal in stats occupying the same level slot (Type-Hei Rifle and M1 Carbine at level 10). The sword could also be given at Level 11 alongside the SMG, I don’t think that is too much to ask.

To continue, let’s talk about SMGs. The Japanese Type 100 SMG has two versions in real life, Early and Late. Their Rate of fire is as follows; Early-450 RPM, Late 800-RPM. Only the Early version is available in the game (at least for the moment). I would say that the Type 100 Late is comparable to the Thompson SMG in use by the US in the game, however for some reason the Type 100 Late is nowhere to be seen.

Next, Semi-Automatic Rifles. At level 13 the Americans get the M1 Garand. However, the Japanese got the Type 99 Rifle of late war construction. This is perhaps the biggest mismatch in armament seen in the campaign as of now. Speaking of which, in real life the Pedersen rifle (of which the Type-Hei rifle is based upon, also the Japanese version looks a lot different than depicted in the game) has 10 rounds, instead of five.

Smaller problem, but still noticeable; Sniper Rifles. The first Sniper Rifles that either side gets; US-Springfield with Unertl Scope (x8 Magnification) while the Japanese gets the Type 97 with 2.5x Magnification scope. However, this is somewhat offset by the Type 97 being able to accept Stripper clips while the Springfield Sniper Rifle cannot. Somewhat supported by real life examples as the Japanese does not field high magnification scopes

Now I understand that this campaign has only been online for less than a month, but that is precisely why I wrote this article, to correct these problems before it gets worse along the way. Hopefully it gets seen by a developer who cares enough to take a look into the balancing issue.

I feel as if this campaign is somewhat based on the Rising Storm Pacific Campaign. However, Rising Storm’s asymmetrical warfare mechanics (Japan can use hand grenades as AP mine, Banzai Charge causes suppression on the enemy, etc.) helps to balance out the inferior equipment on the Japanese part, while here in enlisted there really isn’t anything comparable to that mechanic. I’m not sure where the developers would like to take this campaign; Balanced weaponry like the other campaigns? Or asymmetrical warfare based on Rising Storm? Either is fine, but that’s the point; pick one. As of now the campaign is somewhat in between with unbalanced weaponry, yet no ā€˜gimmick’ for Japan to get a fair match against the US.
One more thing though. I have played on both sides, and from experience, though Japan gets worse equipment, they seem to win more. Most of the battles that I won as Japan (and lost as America) is solely due to objective play from the Japanese side. While I get more kills (and admittedly have a much easier time doing the killing) as the Americans, it seems that rarely does anyone play the objective. On the other hand, Japanese gameplay is quite difficult in the killing department, but often results in victory due to objective pushing. This is all personal experience though.

I hope you enjoyed reading this essay as much as I enjoyed writing it.

Thank you for your attention and have a wonderful day!

7 Likes

AT rifle and hit the engine.

At the same time, the driver hides in the tank and cant be killed by normal guns and meeles.

Because it will come later, probabably with a drum Thompson as ā€œcounterā€.

They do this gear-wise and not by soldier capabilites.

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Thank you for your comment! and thank you for addressing the issues with ways to counter it. Now let’s see…

No issue there, fair enough. However the M13 is still far better than the Ta-Se at clearing infantry and something ought to be done about it.

Fair point, but then what. He can hide in the tank, but basically becomes useless.

Ah yes, very balanced. 30 Rounds SMG vs 50 Rounds SMG with similar rate of fire.

This must be the worst thing about the design then. If the gear is simply better on one side, and inferior on the other with no other balancing mechanics, then one side is just better.

Thank you again for taking the time to comment!

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I’m going to let you in on a secret, shotguns are completely useless in this game so japan actually gets the better end of the stick

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There’s nothing wrong with Japan’s starting rifle.
M13 does seem too durable though. I’ve noticed the Ta Se struggles to pen it with AP and I don’t think that was a problem in war thunder

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'Tis no secret sir, the shotgun is far from useless, as I found out the hard way (or the easy way when I play as the US XD). But thank you for your comment either way!

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Well, the first thing that comes to mind is the sight. Befitting a carbine, the Type 38 Carbine’s sight is much thicker than the American counterpart (Springfield M1903), thus making it more difficult to aim at longer rangers. Though I suppose the counter-argument would be to NOT engage at such ranges.

On the M13, even the Ha-Go with it’s 37mm gun can have a hard time doing any damage to the M13, let alone the Ta-Se. Though this is probably a problem that will persist for a while more as it seems that many armored vehicles in this game has an… interesting… damage model

Thank you for taking the time to comment though!

when compared to SMGs they are, doesn’t matter how good the shotgun is, you’ll get much more milage out of an SMG than you will with a shotgun as shotguns require you to be pressed against the enemy to actually work

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probably true but it still just seems like a nitpick to me. The Type 38 carbine is perfectly serviceable

The Type Hei rifle can feed from 3 different magazines, a 5 round one, a 10 round one and a 20 round one. The 5 round one is the most common one IIRC.

Caliber, IMO, matters less than RoF here. The Type99 Late doesn’t compete with the Springfield because it fires 10rpm slower, while the Typ38 is 10rpm Higher. I’d have liked to see the Type 38 Rifle as the starter, and a Type 99 Early with a better RoF than the Late be the first unlock.

The Sword is better than the shotgun, at the distances where the shotgun makes sense to use. Shotguns in this game are next to worthless, having larger than realistc spread and much lower than realistic damage, and have long reloads, while the sword doesn’t need ammo and makes your soldier faster, and you can give them to every troop, while the shotgun is assaulters/medics only.

This would be a good change. IRL 8mm Nambu is pretty shit, but with the damage it does in game, a boost to RoF would bring it closer to par.

The Type 99 being the same level as the Garand, is nonsense, I’ll grant you that. Should have gone Hei-Type4 Garand-Type Ko Pedersen. And just because the Hei action is based on the Pedersen doesn’t mean it didn’t have a five round magazine, which would be made up for by the 10 round capacity of both the Type 4 Garand and Type Ko Pedersen.

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Dear friend, I agree with most of your text, thing is: Dark Flow/ Gaijin haven’t fixed problems that are coming from the beginning of the game, and you think that they’re going to fix new errors or wrong stuff?? Nope, I’m sorry to spoil all the fun, but all they want now is get as much money as they can and run away with it.
Obviously you gonna find people that defend these companies or the game itself, but be my guest on checking old problems that still bother everyone.

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Thank you for your comment good sir, and no I am under no impression that these issues will be fixed. I have a little conspiracy theory as to why they will not be fixed, especially on the Pacific Campaign, but I suppose that is not for this forum.

Is that so, perhaps I haven’t read enough on the matter. Thank you for the information. I still think it should be 10 to offset what the Americans get, but perhaps that’s just me.

Let’s try again, I’ll make sure that my reply is well organized this time.

I see. I agree on the rate of fire, but what would happen to the Type 99 Late in this case? Just dropped altogether? To be honest, I don’t mind that XD

This is the second time someone said this on this post, and fourth counting my two friends saying the same thing. Perhaps there is truth to it that the shotgun is bad.

This I agree with completely.

Yep, and I read up more on the Type Hei rifle. It does indeed have 5 rounds magazine. I was basing my understanding of the gun on the Pedersen rifle, which was a mistake.

Haha… Yeah I understand what you mean. I highly doubt this will even be seen by a developer. If it does, I hope he cares enough to reply.

You’re right. I made a mistake of basing my understanding of the gun on the Pedersen, and not the actual Type-Hei.

Perhaps you are right in this regard. I guess I would prefer the Type 38 Rifle as the standard weapon for historical reasons, which barely matters in this game.

Hm, quite a few people have mentioned that the shotgun really is bad. Personally I haven’t had much trouble with it, but that might have to do with me not using it often. If enough people says that it’s true, it probably is.

Hopefully my reply won’t clog up the whole board like I did the first time around.

i would rather that they have put 10 round or 20 round one for upgrade instead of otsu… or type 99…

Shotguns aren’t ā€œbadā€ but a SMG is always better, especially a high RoF SMG.

Fair, especially if the loader of the Jap tank dies.

He could drive away and camp.

What do you expect? Japan is a crap nation if we dont consider their naval strenght. Its basically Italy with worse tank (yes, thats possible) and no Germany as Vaterland nation for a two-faction campaign and heck even Pacific Allies who deployed outdated stuff from Europe there are better.
Im not suprised. Im rather surprised that Df decided to merge ALL mid- to late-war campaigns into one campaign which is nothing but stupid. Understandable to some extend, but still stupid.

This is the concept of Enlisted. You grind and equip your squad with stuff and most people go for the better stuff.
Its basically HnG with ā€œbetterā€ game- and gunplay and AI squads.

Thats why we have Pacific.
Because people are tired to play and grind the Germans AGAIN.
IMHO a Korea-War campaign would make so much more sense and wouldnt be that far from WW2 (and @Conscript_Joe gets his M26) than making weird campaigns with Japan or another one-sided Europe-theatre where either Germans get another safespace or Allies another sealclubbing backyard.

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Yeah it do be like that.

That’s one tenacious tanker in that case.

Oh I am quite willing to sacrifice historical accuracy for better gameplay. The Devs already kind of did with the whole Japan having SMGs a-plenty and Semi-auto Rifles anyway. They were willing to do that, I wonder what’s keeping them from making Japan a little stronger than in real life :thinking:

Am I understanding this correctly; The concept of Enlisted is two factions fighting with one faction simply being better than the other in most regards? That is one… fascinating… concept if that is the case.

LMAO there’s truth to that. Personally I’d prefer the Chinese theater, but we all know why that won’t happen :zipper_mouth_face: