Not at all.
US troops using British equipment might be a fairly rare case, but British soldier using US equipment and German using Italian equipment and vice versa was very common.
Almost all mass produced American equipment has also been used by Commonwealth forces, many tanks and aircraft as well.
Some of these would need to be in both tech trees.
Britian had no AR, no modern semi-auto rifles, nothing for SF rifles, no rocket launchers ect. These holes will obviously get filled with “lend-leased” equipment like the new Soviet AT gun.
Unless DF can round up a lot of obscure prototypes like the type hei auto which players already so “satisfied” with
Italy and Germany is even worse since in 1943 following the Italian split, Germany took control of much of Italy and set up a puppet state.
RSI did have its own armed forces but that was relatively small. Most factories were producing Italian equipment for Germany.
The Heer absorbed Italian weapons, vehicles, stockpiles and numerous military personel.
These personel have used a wide variety of German equipment, from Italian pilots flying with Bf-109s to SS infantry with Stg44 and Panzerfaust or FG42s in Fallschirmjäger divisions.
The problem is that both factions could be justified to have all equipment with the exceptions of Volkstrum weapons and prototypes.
I said a quarter because Darkflow would minimise the shared equipment but honestly it’s just a rough estimate assuming that the TT gets filled with stupid protos and equipment from other nations like Hungary alongside Italy.
Thanks for the detailed response. You’re right that all this happned IRL. But for the sake of the game you can look up previous proposals for Italian / British(commonwealth) Tech Trees and you can see that people have found examples for almost every kind of weapon/Vehicle to achive some level of parity with the other Tech Trees already in the game.
Of course some prototype and a little paper would need to be used but even with lended Items you would still struggle to reach 25% “copy paste”, at least for Italy, the only things that would truly be copy paste would be:
G41
MG34
Pz.III
Panzer Fausts
And Paper:
P43.bis
60mm LanciaBombe
In short, If they could do it for Japan they could certainly do it for IT/GB.
This is also something you cannot ignore. Some countires like Hungary and Romania have unique things to offer and personally I think they would fit well into an Italian Tech Tree. This would help in two ways:
It would declutter the German TT
It would bolster the Italian TT and provide a space to represent the smaller axis nations.
Same goes for common wealth nations like Canada and Australia.
I’ve always said we should have UK separate and include the various Commonwealth nations (such as my country Australia)
Likewise Italy separate and include the minor Axis nations.
For this thread overall, I understand the devs have no plans for this (though I do believe it ought to happen).
But I am awfully sick and tired of people repeating the same misinformation that UK-Commonwealth or Italy + Other Axis Nations wouldnt have enough tech.
There’s been a number of suggestions about this, with various solutions. I know there were at least 1 or 2 proposed tech trees of just the UK and just Italy alone and they still had plenty of tech.
Once you add the Commonwealth and Other Axis Nations respectively, there’s more than enough.
People get so worked up about copy paste, it astounds me. The actual evidence for many proposed tech trees shows how little copy paste there would actually be.
And if we take UK-Commonwealth for example, is it really going to ruin the game it having one M9 Bazooka? (the PIAT could stand in for the M1 Bazooka).
Then with Thompsons, just give USA and UK different types of Thompsons (like the British often seemed to use the more ‘Prohibition gangster’ style with the front grip, whereas USA tended to have the M1A1 version)
I recall one proposed Italian tech tree had some German copy paste like the MG34, but other forum members quickly found Italian alternatives for those.
Britain and Italy, but especially Britain, have more than enough content to have their independent faction
But like I say if Britain and Italy may not be its own independent faction for the foreseeable future……for now….then there are steps to at least flesh them out. Plus adding more of their weapons, vehicles, and planes into the current tree
Instead of shooting down ideas, perhaps you should read people’s suggestions?
For example for a high tier automatic gun there is the Rieder rifle which was used by South Africa.
As for Japan personally I think DF and the playerbase needs to get its head out of the sand with nonsense high tier. There’s no law that says we HAVE to have high tier.
If a faction is struggling to fill BR V, then just dont do BR V for that faction. That also doesnt mean the faction as a whole cant exist.
Japan should be BR IV max. We should have UK + Commonwealth and Italy + Other Axis Nations as separate trees. Maybe UK and Italy could go to BR IV if its that much of an issue.
The only ‘new’ faction id add would be a combined tree of France-Poland-Belgium-Netherlands. I have made a full post about that before. It would be BR I-III, though its probable there are some BR IV weapons that could work.
To be honest it would make sense historically that only USSR, Germany and USA get to BR V.
UK, Italy, Japan and France-Poland all get to BR IV.
With all due respect to DF since they build some cool stuff. I would rather see them building new tech tree weapons, adding new uniforms and building new maps with all new battles like Iwo Jima, Okinawa and Dunkirk, then see them spending their time creating premium Guerrilla squads. However, I did purchase the squad, so don’t stop now.
Personally Im very annoyed they created a specific Australian squad… but didnt give them slouch hats or digger hats.
Like seriously? Cmon!! That’s how we identify them as Australians.
Oh and of course:
American squad with Owen guns
Australian squad with Ithaca shotguns.
What next, a Canadian squad with Norwegian weapons??
I, on the other hand, alongside others, am a proponent for keep them where they are, to allow mixed units for those who wish for.
since splitting units to create new factions has all kind of implications.
for starter, loosing items that i grinded on my main USA / Axis
which it’s funny that you quoted my messages, because it gives a pretty good reason on why you shouldn’t split USA.
half of their smg and all of their mg would be gone.
not offering a whole lot of choises either.
if the game was historical accurate, there could have been an argument on why us and viceversa were using allied equipment, but since it ain’t.
it doesn’t hold a whole much.
not to mention, devs did stated it’s not planned.
but you do you.
ps. they couldn’t fix a camo in half a year.
it took them 7 months to fix the rally points issue back in the beta ( where players spawned with invincibility ).
it took them 2 years to fix bipods
it took them 2 years to fully implement the merge
so… you know
you are kinda very optimistic about them splitting and making a new faction.
but you do have a point.
japan was sort of a mistake.
not fully complete, and opened the gates for fantasy-wonderland.
could have simply stuck to pves or mods.
but that’s my opinion.
for what is worth anyway.
None of them are very realistic.
They usually over estimate equipment capabilities and they still leave huge gaps in the tree.
Even the paper P43bis would be a BR4 tank at best and BR5 would need to filled with German tanks.
A likely list of copy pasted equipment:
Mannlicher M1895
K98K (GGP40) or PzB39
ZH29
FG42 I
FG42 II
(scoped G43 unless scoped zh29 possible)
scoped StG or FG
mp28
Mp40
TZ-45 or zk383
mkb42 (H)
StG44
ZB26
Mg34
MG34 (dualdrum)
Panzer III J
Panzer III N
Panzer IV G
StuG G
Panzer IV H
Tiger I
Tiger II
Aircrafts are iffy since Italy does have some potent strong fighter aircraft so Bf-109s would only supplement the force, but they would still need strong attacker aircraft, but DF might be able to find German/Hungarian CAS that hasn’t been added yet or they can go full lazy mode and just give the same CAS to both Axis factions.
Other equipment such as mortars, flamethrowers ect may just stay the same German equipment.
And they were bad.
Like the Russian troll trees were filled with American and French stuff. I do not recall their Italian troll tree except that post-level 3 was filled with German tanks, planes and launchers as well.
